Saturday, September 19, 2009
21crosscheck21 posts a sensationalized video PLUS a bonus hell rant
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHBNXrBYqow
I urge everyone to go to youtube to watch this video and read ABibleReader's comments about what the mother said about this tragedy..She thinks it was murder. Also,ABibleReader made some logical truthful comments about how Christians traumatize kids with hellfire preachin' consistently.(I personally was traumatized by my great grandpa's passionate preaching about it when I was little)As well as facts about how prominent suicide is for boys this age.So to isolate a JW case and blame it on the WT when NOTHING is known is just bizarre.This is a tragedy to be sure ..That is why I hate to see it being exploited when no one knows the facts!!
WHY else do I think it was wrong for Brian to post this?Because news programs are about sensationalism.No one knows what happened!So to sensationalize something like this and to think that preaching Armageddon is an abomination when you personally preach something as heinous atrocious monstrous and disgusting as eternal hellfire is hypocritical and preposterous.I like Brian and that is why it upsets me all the more to see intelligent nice people like him exploiting something like this when they have a massive erroneous doctrine like hellfire they use like a weapon against anyone they wish up their theological sleeve.I know one argument traditionalists will use is that their children are assured of a heavenly calling.Well I for one would find no comfort in that whatsoever if my little friends at school who weren't as "Christian" as I would never be fanned in the flames of hell.Talk about traumatic!And what about family who perhaps think Jesus is God's son as opposed to God or don't believe at all?I have to live with their screams of terror for an infinity in a supposedly blissful kingdom?PLEASE!If I believed in hell,I would live and breathe traumatized!And it is truly a perturbing thing to be child trying with all your little heart and soul to understand how love and mercy can be reconciled with hellfire and how God's son is God!I knew God could not be balanced or truthful at all if these lies were true!John 3:16 alone disproves both.Believe it or not,I am not advocating the excessive WT depictions of Armageddon etc. but trust me..logically,heartfeltly,it is the lesser of two evils.To say the least!Children have VIVID imaginations and sensitive hearts and it doesn't take pictures for them to "see" what you tell them to believe!Poor kids.How very big of you Brian to lambast people who preach destruction when you preach the boldfaced lie of eternal life in flames for the majority of mankind!The same ol Satanic lie..no one ever REALLY dies.Back to the Garden of Eden for some education.
Genesis 3:19:For dust you are and to dust you will return.
Sounds kinda like :
Matthew 3:12 His winnowing shovel is in his hand, and he will completely clean up his threshing floor, and will gather his wheat into the storehouse, but the chaff he will BURN UP with fire that cannot be put out.(what happens in fire Brian?Did anyone stay alive in gehenna?)
I'm thinkin' in John 3:16 ,when it says the wicked shall perish,that it pretty much means what it says!
To anyone who lives to criticize the WT for their faults(and yes they have them I know!)Time to examine yourself first.
Matthew 7:3 Why, then, do you look at the straw in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the rafter in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Allow me to extract the straw from your eye’; when, look! a rafter is in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First extract the rafter from your own eye, and then you will see clearly how to extract the straw from your brother’s eye.
If the WT is a cult what would you call the broad and spacious road that preaches "Christianity's" two biggest most detrimental lies..the trinity and hell?You'd probably call it "truth" if you're fond of tradition and philosophy of men.But I would venture to say you're fooling yourself.God said "This is my son"..what about THAT is hard to understand?God also said "The wicked shall perish"..That is precise language as well..
I sincerely hope Brian takes no offense but instead continues to prayerfully investigate his core beliefs as I think he is a smart man who Jah could use to grand effect with the right humble spirit,willingness to reform..AGAIN,and to accept blatant truth when it is shown him straight from the pages of scripture.I am not talking about symbolic texts being taken literally and elaborate inferences about God's son being anything but his father's servant and agent and son in some philosophical 4th century manmade formula either.God how I pray truth will reign and become clearer to the sincere hearted as time draws closer for the establishment of His perfect kingdom restored to this earth.
Here's the reality,Brian.You are judging people who preach annihilation when you preach hellfire!The hypocrisy and absurdity there is striking!Yes the pictures might disturb children..(please note JW children are taught positive things from scripture more than armageddon)..But to confidently articulate(yes I've heard you speak about your beliefs) a fiery fairy tale of the worst kind of sadistic evil man or child could EVER imagine?UNFORGIVABLE.Here's hoping you and every other stubborn Christian will delve deeply into logic and exegesis and pick apart every text they think proves hellfire and "make sure of all things",holding fast to what is good and true!
You can start by googling "everlasting torment examined" by Steve Scianni.And that's just the beginning of exegesis available that actually remains within the bounds of logic,recognizing the symbolism and hyperbole in Revelation,understanding what gehenna entails,refusing to look at words like "destroyed,perish,ashes" as anything but what they would reasonably say.etc.Why?Because you're preaching the same lie Satan did and traumatizing children and adults alike.Those who don't just look for any way out that they can..like atheism..to avoid believing in a sadist God.You don't know his personality and that confounds me!The bible is clear.The worst that ever happened to sinners?Agony leading to death.That satisfies God's wrath against sin.To get rid of it.His holiness is magnified in "making all things new" without the preservation of the most heinous evil man could ever imagine into all of eternity.That would hamper the kingdom peace,no?
Friday, September 11, 2009
Earthlings
Time to wake up to the way the animals you eat and wear are treated and killed.How barbaric humans can be!Truly frightening.Animals are SENTIENT remarkable creatures who we are supposed to care for with the highest regard.I'm sure some would rather stay ignorant than face the truth.As I watched this,I thought about not only how the animals and myself felt,but how Jehovah himself would feel.Jehovah's heart is bigger than ours so there is no reason he would find this acceptable or accept that we would rather remain ignorant to this kind of disregard for life and abuse of animals who ,yes,have feelings.What about how the animals are handled and treated in the process of making them our food and clothing and in experimentation etc?UNACCEPTABLE.I urge you to watch this entire documentary,narrated by Joaquin Phoenix.It is NOT an easy watch,but an important one.
The heart of the NWO
I like this guy's channel because he fearlessly exposes the evil in the government and the entertainment industry with passion.I'm sure I would disagree with points in his theology but I recommend his channel..theforerunner777..He also recently posted some eye opening videos about Jay-Z and the music industry and their involvement in nefarious schemes.Wicked spirit forces in high places indeed!Check those out too.Even if just a portion of it is true..it's enough to understand Satan's schemes even better.
Friday, August 28, 2009
Calvinism rant 2..
This was written by someone else a while ago..Another Calvinism rant I would say!
http://hungertruth.blogspot.com/2006/10/synod-of-dort-fear-and-power-worship.html
http://hungertruth.blogspot.com/2006/10/synod-of-dort-fear-and-power-worship.html
Wednesday, August 26, 2009
Calvinism rant..
I had this up before then removed it for fear of offending Calvinists because it has kind of a harsh tone.But since it is all true and from my heart and meant to make Calvinists think about what they believe I shall repost.
Couple QUICK questions:Why was God so appalled at people's wicked behavior like burning their children in fire to Molech if he decreed and desired it?Was he pretending to be disgusted about something he in fact decreed?Why if we were created in God's image would we be sickened to contemplate the things that the God of Calvinism "decreed for his fine pleasure" and then think God whose love and justice and mercy and goodness are FAR superior to ours as fallen humans wouldn't?Similar to the "trinity" and "hellfire" "proof texts" there are FAR SUPERIOR interpretations to calvinist "proof texts" that gel with God's love in a much more tenable,reasonable and defensible way.
Jeremiah 19:5:They have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as offerings to Baal—something I did not command or mention, nor did it enter my mind
1 John 4:8,16:God is love.
Contemplate what LOVE means,HONESTLY assessing it.That is his dominant quality.That is who HE IS.The God of Calvinism is like the original serpent who he condemns,causing everyone he chooses to be tortured in sadistic flames eternally for his pleasure,pure evil.It is hard enough explaining to non Christians why God PERMITS suffering..the God of Calvinism wouldn't exactly be easy to defend ,but,thankfully,He isn't the God of the bible.
If you're a Calvinist reading this,I hope you won't be quick to take offense but will be quick to read the bible in it's entirety and see what the scriptures speak loudly and clearly about from cover to cover.God has no part with evil.God is love.
God created everything PERFECT and then some of that creation REBELLED and BECAME evil without his assistance.Yes he allowed the downfall of man to occur because of the rebellion but he DID NOT decree the rebellion and he does not harbor the characteristics of Satan.He is NOT a sadistic evil deceiver and liar who said he was love but meant "I decree child rape".He warned Adam and Eve of the consequences of their idiotic decisions and they did NOT include him being the puppetmaster of every man who is evil and every man who is not.Just like Adam and Eve did,we have CHOICES ..Yes,God draws us.Yes,we can resist.Why?Because free will isn't a fantasy but a scriptural truth.And whoever says it isn't doesn't seem to understand that God is not partial just to be partial..He examines hearts and blesses those who draw close to him because they see him in the creation and understand his beauty and love.He wants those who want him and not those he has to make want him just because he can.That would be the equivalent of a man taking a woman hostage and forcing her to marry him just because he can..and then claiming that he is the epitome of love while also throwing whoever he he wants into an eternal fire for no reason but that it pleases him and somehow magnifies his holiness(even though this idea is NOT one in scripture)!.BUT he is love ..how ironic.
You can pretty much bet that if God wants us to be repulsed by the torture of people then he is repulsed by the torture of people and not pleased by torturing people infinitely AT ALL.Unless ,of course,our heartstrings are superior to God's.It's also a safe bet to assume that if God doesn't want us to be partial but to care lovingly for the most downtrodden that HE is NOT partial either and would never decree an orphan to an infinity in a literal lake of fire just because he can.Absurd.Yes,God's ways are higher than our ways.But,that does not mean sadism trumps love and mercy.And that the love and mercy we feel for fellow human beings without partiality is something too precious for God because supposedly wrath and sadistic decrees overtake those beautiful qualities he has and no mercy is up his sleeve in the flames of hell!The consistent testimony of scripture from beginning to end is that God is IMPARTIAL and LOVE,that his justice is temperd with mercy.Christ suffered an agonizing death ..God was merciful and let him die and not continue to be tortured.That's what will happen to us(agony that leads to death) if we have to pay for our own sins..that's right..our OWN sins..sins that God did NOT decree.God detests the evil and wickedness in the world which would logically lead any sincere heart to the conclusion that he did not DECREE IT.Now we are witnessing what happens when the world rebels against God and we needed to see this so we would know.So we would understand that he is the ONLY one who can bring peace and lead us in the way that is good and fruitful and blessed.If we did not see this now we wouldn't know and that is one reason he permits the suffering temporarily..he is not the Satanic one causing the sin but the loving one allowing it so we would know the hell it brings and could repent of it and live in a new world where it will exist no more where all things will be "made new" and there will be no more evil period,certainly not the flames of a fairy tale hell!
In Ezekial he is instructed to put a mark on the foreheads of those sighing and groaning over all the DETESTABLE things being done.Those with the mark would be saved because they weren't enjoying those detestable things but instead were disturbed by them.Now if God favors those who hate the detestable things would it REALLY make sense to think he himself decreed them and is in the same boat with the ones who took pleasure in them?I really cannot think of anything more despicable or heinous than hellfire.I sigh and groan over it.What about you?And don't even think about comin back at me with annihilation and how it will be detestable too.There is NO comparison.One is necessary and just and the punishment made clear for the wicked from Genesis on when God told Adam he would return to dust...the other is infinite sadism from a God people say is love..Hello atheist..meet the orthodox Christian God.Don't question anything,just embrace the tradition regardless of how illogical or asinine.Regardless of other interpretive possibilities that may be superior.Regardless of clear scriptural truths like God being impartial,merciful and loving and the wicked having to PERISH.In actuality,God is extremely partial,sadistic and unmerciful and tradition trumps logic and fact.Right?No balance with the Calvinist God.No impartiality.Quite frankly,no love.Yet,scripture says he IS love and he isn't partial.That is how I know right off the bat that Calvinism is false.Manmade.Just like love is God's dominant quality,it is also a grand theme in the bible which is absolutely in irrefutable opposition to Calvinism's whole mind and heartset.
God HATES wickedness and evil therefore he did not DECREE it.Common sense.If he has foreknowledge of something how would this be proof that he CAUSED it.Allowing and then being disgusted by it (soon to intervene) is a trillion miles away from decreeing it,taking pleasure in it and then extending his wrath into all eternity against poor people who were chosen by him for flames so that a sadistically "righteous" "new creation" could see how mean and big God can be even though he is supposed to epitomize love.
God's scales of justice are for the wicked to perish and "eye for an eye".The hellfire doctrine isn't an "eye" for anything!And it CERTAINLY isn't logical and there is NO excuse for taking a symbolic book like revelation and interpreting NON symbolic texts about the wicked perishing in light of the symbolic ones instead of the other way around.
May God's love and mercy and impartiality abound in your heart.You were created in his image with the capacity to be reasonable and to question what you're taught from men.Don't cease ever questioning what you're taught from men.Don't let your heart be hardened to the feeling that a God who is the one of Calvinism and Orthodox Christianity with the whole "hellfire thing" and "partial thing" is reasonably NOT LOVE.Then you may find the true One from scripture who is and embrace worshipping him in truth.
Contemplate(seriously) the life of Christ..did he seem like a man who would go around tapping heads that he desired to torment eternally and letting the heads untapped survive the wrath and live in "peace" while enjoying the cacophany of screams of the less fortunate (or maybe they don't even have to hear them..that would be better..but still unbearably HORRENDOUS for ANYONE righteous just knowing this was goin on)?Did he seem like a man who would look at two children and decide to torture one and save the other just because he's powerful?Did he seem like a man who scouted "vessels" for wrath even though he healed ALL the sick and embraced all who came to him?Was he love or was he partial and angry at those who he decreed to be his vessels of wrath just because he takes pleasure in seeing people suffer because it magnifies his "holiness"?The Calvinist Jesus is not the bible's Jesus.This should be pretty clear.And as a Calvinist,did you become one AFTER hearing intricate arguments and justifications from men OR did you get the impression from scripture itself that God's love is trumped by power trips?The wisdom of men like James White is foolishness to God. A well constructed ridiculously sharp argument can make ANYTHING sound plausible..but is that what God wants us to do?Ignore the simplicity of texts and take a few that SEEM to support something and make sure we make the entire bible fit it by twisting texts everywhere even though we should see if these texts CLEARLY in the minority can't conform to the entire bible.And they can.There are reasonable and superior interpretations available for Calvinist's delight if only they'll partake.
To reiiterate and to be realistic.God is impartial..God is love.Even when his severe wrath needs to be satisfied and his holiness magnified..the worst that happened was agony then death.And only against those willful unrepentant sinners that had the CHOICE to sin or not..he wasn't pulling their strings to make 'em.And if he was,he never told us this.
I'm just putting one part of this series here about Romans chapter 9(James White's lifeblood)but I urge you to watch all (I think 6) parts.These are some superior interpretations to the traditional Calvinist ones that are IN LINE with the TOTALITY of scripture which is that God is love.In Calvinism,God does despicable things that are not in harmony with the personality the bible provides for Him.As for this guy's beliefs,I'm sure I would disagree with him on MANY,but not on his thoughts about calvinism. Search:Romans 9: Predestination or Free Will? on youtube for the rest of this series.Enjoy!I need to rewatch it myself!
Honestly.I didn't even know how strongly I felt about Calvinism till I wrote this.If this defense against it seems harsh..that would be because there is no reason for me not to scream from the rooftop that God is love.. hell is a lie.. and God is not a tyrant.I am a Christian BECAUSE God is love.BECAUSE he is impartial.AND because He gave us free will,allowing us to choose him or not.We are free creatures.I appreciate that!THANK YOU GOD.
"I never know what I think about something until I read what I've written on it"~William Faulkner
Couple QUICK questions:Why was God so appalled at people's wicked behavior like burning their children in fire to Molech if he decreed and desired it?Was he pretending to be disgusted about something he in fact decreed?Why if we were created in God's image would we be sickened to contemplate the things that the God of Calvinism "decreed for his fine pleasure" and then think God whose love and justice and mercy and goodness are FAR superior to ours as fallen humans wouldn't?Similar to the "trinity" and "hellfire" "proof texts" there are FAR SUPERIOR interpretations to calvinist "proof texts" that gel with God's love in a much more tenable,reasonable and defensible way.
Jeremiah 19:5:They have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as offerings to Baal—something I did not command or mention, nor did it enter my mind
1 John 4:8,16:God is love.
Contemplate what LOVE means,HONESTLY assessing it.That is his dominant quality.That is who HE IS.The God of Calvinism is like the original serpent who he condemns,causing everyone he chooses to be tortured in sadistic flames eternally for his pleasure,pure evil.It is hard enough explaining to non Christians why God PERMITS suffering..the God of Calvinism wouldn't exactly be easy to defend ,but,thankfully,He isn't the God of the bible.
If you're a Calvinist reading this,I hope you won't be quick to take offense but will be quick to read the bible in it's entirety and see what the scriptures speak loudly and clearly about from cover to cover.God has no part with evil.God is love.
God created everything PERFECT and then some of that creation REBELLED and BECAME evil without his assistance.Yes he allowed the downfall of man to occur because of the rebellion but he DID NOT decree the rebellion and he does not harbor the characteristics of Satan.He is NOT a sadistic evil deceiver and liar who said he was love but meant "I decree child rape".He warned Adam and Eve of the consequences of their idiotic decisions and they did NOT include him being the puppetmaster of every man who is evil and every man who is not.Just like Adam and Eve did,we have CHOICES ..Yes,God draws us.Yes,we can resist.Why?Because free will isn't a fantasy but a scriptural truth.And whoever says it isn't doesn't seem to understand that God is not partial just to be partial..He examines hearts and blesses those who draw close to him because they see him in the creation and understand his beauty and love.He wants those who want him and not those he has to make want him just because he can.That would be the equivalent of a man taking a woman hostage and forcing her to marry him just because he can..and then claiming that he is the epitome of love while also throwing whoever he he wants into an eternal fire for no reason but that it pleases him and somehow magnifies his holiness(even though this idea is NOT one in scripture)!.BUT he is love ..how ironic.
You can pretty much bet that if God wants us to be repulsed by the torture of people then he is repulsed by the torture of people and not pleased by torturing people infinitely AT ALL.Unless ,of course,our heartstrings are superior to God's.It's also a safe bet to assume that if God doesn't want us to be partial but to care lovingly for the most downtrodden that HE is NOT partial either and would never decree an orphan to an infinity in a literal lake of fire just because he can.Absurd.Yes,God's ways are higher than our ways.But,that does not mean sadism trumps love and mercy.And that the love and mercy we feel for fellow human beings without partiality is something too precious for God because supposedly wrath and sadistic decrees overtake those beautiful qualities he has and no mercy is up his sleeve in the flames of hell!The consistent testimony of scripture from beginning to end is that God is IMPARTIAL and LOVE,that his justice is temperd with mercy.Christ suffered an agonizing death ..God was merciful and let him die and not continue to be tortured.That's what will happen to us(agony that leads to death) if we have to pay for our own sins..that's right..our OWN sins..sins that God did NOT decree.God detests the evil and wickedness in the world which would logically lead any sincere heart to the conclusion that he did not DECREE IT.Now we are witnessing what happens when the world rebels against God and we needed to see this so we would know.So we would understand that he is the ONLY one who can bring peace and lead us in the way that is good and fruitful and blessed.If we did not see this now we wouldn't know and that is one reason he permits the suffering temporarily..he is not the Satanic one causing the sin but the loving one allowing it so we would know the hell it brings and could repent of it and live in a new world where it will exist no more where all things will be "made new" and there will be no more evil period,certainly not the flames of a fairy tale hell!
In Ezekial he is instructed to put a mark on the foreheads of those sighing and groaning over all the DETESTABLE things being done.Those with the mark would be saved because they weren't enjoying those detestable things but instead were disturbed by them.Now if God favors those who hate the detestable things would it REALLY make sense to think he himself decreed them and is in the same boat with the ones who took pleasure in them?I really cannot think of anything more despicable or heinous than hellfire.I sigh and groan over it.What about you?And don't even think about comin back at me with annihilation and how it will be detestable too.There is NO comparison.One is necessary and just and the punishment made clear for the wicked from Genesis on when God told Adam he would return to dust...the other is infinite sadism from a God people say is love..Hello atheist..meet the orthodox Christian God.Don't question anything,just embrace the tradition regardless of how illogical or asinine.Regardless of other interpretive possibilities that may be superior.Regardless of clear scriptural truths like God being impartial,merciful and loving and the wicked having to PERISH.In actuality,God is extremely partial,sadistic and unmerciful and tradition trumps logic and fact.Right?No balance with the Calvinist God.No impartiality.Quite frankly,no love.Yet,scripture says he IS love and he isn't partial.That is how I know right off the bat that Calvinism is false.Manmade.Just like love is God's dominant quality,it is also a grand theme in the bible which is absolutely in irrefutable opposition to Calvinism's whole mind and heartset.
God HATES wickedness and evil therefore he did not DECREE it.Common sense.If he has foreknowledge of something how would this be proof that he CAUSED it.Allowing and then being disgusted by it (soon to intervene) is a trillion miles away from decreeing it,taking pleasure in it and then extending his wrath into all eternity against poor people who were chosen by him for flames so that a sadistically "righteous" "new creation" could see how mean and big God can be even though he is supposed to epitomize love.
God's scales of justice are for the wicked to perish and "eye for an eye".The hellfire doctrine isn't an "eye" for anything!And it CERTAINLY isn't logical and there is NO excuse for taking a symbolic book like revelation and interpreting NON symbolic texts about the wicked perishing in light of the symbolic ones instead of the other way around.
May God's love and mercy and impartiality abound in your heart.You were created in his image with the capacity to be reasonable and to question what you're taught from men.Don't cease ever questioning what you're taught from men.Don't let your heart be hardened to the feeling that a God who is the one of Calvinism and Orthodox Christianity with the whole "hellfire thing" and "partial thing" is reasonably NOT LOVE.Then you may find the true One from scripture who is and embrace worshipping him in truth.
Contemplate(seriously) the life of Christ..did he seem like a man who would go around tapping heads that he desired to torment eternally and letting the heads untapped survive the wrath and live in "peace" while enjoying the cacophany of screams of the less fortunate (or maybe they don't even have to hear them..that would be better..but still unbearably HORRENDOUS for ANYONE righteous just knowing this was goin on)?Did he seem like a man who would look at two children and decide to torture one and save the other just because he's powerful?Did he seem like a man who scouted "vessels" for wrath even though he healed ALL the sick and embraced all who came to him?Was he love or was he partial and angry at those who he decreed to be his vessels of wrath just because he takes pleasure in seeing people suffer because it magnifies his "holiness"?The Calvinist Jesus is not the bible's Jesus.This should be pretty clear.And as a Calvinist,did you become one AFTER hearing intricate arguments and justifications from men OR did you get the impression from scripture itself that God's love is trumped by power trips?The wisdom of men like James White is foolishness to God. A well constructed ridiculously sharp argument can make ANYTHING sound plausible..but is that what God wants us to do?Ignore the simplicity of texts and take a few that SEEM to support something and make sure we make the entire bible fit it by twisting texts everywhere even though we should see if these texts CLEARLY in the minority can't conform to the entire bible.And they can.There are reasonable and superior interpretations available for Calvinist's delight if only they'll partake.
To reiiterate and to be realistic.God is impartial..God is love.Even when his severe wrath needs to be satisfied and his holiness magnified..the worst that happened was agony then death.And only against those willful unrepentant sinners that had the CHOICE to sin or not..he wasn't pulling their strings to make 'em.And if he was,he never told us this.
I'm just putting one part of this series here about Romans chapter 9(James White's lifeblood)but I urge you to watch all (I think 6) parts.These are some superior interpretations to the traditional Calvinist ones that are IN LINE with the TOTALITY of scripture which is that God is love.In Calvinism,God does despicable things that are not in harmony with the personality the bible provides for Him.As for this guy's beliefs,I'm sure I would disagree with him on MANY,but not on his thoughts about calvinism. Search:Romans 9: Predestination or Free Will? on youtube for the rest of this series.Enjoy!I need to rewatch it myself!
Honestly.I didn't even know how strongly I felt about Calvinism till I wrote this.If this defense against it seems harsh..that would be because there is no reason for me not to scream from the rooftop that God is love.. hell is a lie.. and God is not a tyrant.I am a Christian BECAUSE God is love.BECAUSE he is impartial.AND because He gave us free will,allowing us to choose him or not.We are free creatures.I appreciate that!THANK YOU GOD.
"I never know what I think about something until I read what I've written on it"~William Faulkner
Wednesday, August 5, 2009
Answering a trinitarian's comment..
Answering a comment on my last blog:
SonOfAJewishCarpenter said...
you said:
" “…if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” —Rom. 10:9
I already covered how Jesus had to be MADE LORD and I confess that readily and without hesitation.I also confess that God raised him from death and that he is alive to plead for me now at God's right hand.Yet to Christians I'm not a christian at all.Interesting."
What is interesting about this comment is that you seem more interested in confessing that Jesus was MADE LORD more than you are in confessing him as YOUR LORD. Regardless of your oppinion of Him, He IS soverign over you and ALL of creation.
Jesus is the only One who can save people.
His name is the only power in the world
that has been given to save people.
We must be saved through him.
Acts 4:12
Jesus saith unto him,
I am the way, the truth, and the life:
no man cometh unto the Father, but by me;
John 14:6
I, even I, am the LORD;
and beside me there is no saviour.
Isa 43:11
SonOfAJewishCarpenter,
Thanks for your comment.The following is said assuming you're trinitarian..
Yes,Jesus had to be made Lord.And yes,he is my Lord.And no he couldn't have saved if he hadn't been sent forth to do so by his father.God so loved the world that he gave his special Son to die for us.I sincerely hope you understand the sacrifice Jesus's father made at least as much as the one his Son did.And that Jesus worships his father as the Only True God so there is no reason anyone else shouldn't.Jesus said "We worship what WE know.."..including himself as One who worships his father in spirit and truth.Does his father worship him?If not,there is no coequality.An Almighty God in no way logically would be worshipping someone else called Almighty God within his own "being"..That is unreasonable in the highest degree and not supported in scripture or explicitly stated anywhere.Also,that would equal two Almighties already regardless of what ANYONE says to make it "go away".Even if they share the SAME "substance" within the 1 "godhead" as separate individuals it would STILL equal 2 Almighty Gods.
I don't disagree with any scripture you provide.Jesus is absolutely the way,the truth,the life.His father used him to save us,making him mediator and king and Lord.Why shouldn't he?He's a proud father with an obedient faithful and inimitable Son he "approves",who is "beloved".The best proof Jesus was created ?He is called "God's Son."
John 10:34 Jesus answered them: “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I said: “you are gods”’? 35 If he called ‘gods’ those against whom the word of God came, and yet the Scripture cannot be nullified, 36 do you say to me whom the Father sanctified and dispatched into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, I am God’s Son?
"God's Son" would be HIGHLY illogical language to use for someone who IS "TRUE God".You won't find the bible itself stating that Jesus shares God's "essence" or "nature" as one of three persons in God's "being" so no one should formulate a doctrine to accomodate philosophies that support this.
I am not demoting Christ..I am recognizing his God-given position as the Second Most High over all the Universe,never said to exist within the same "being" as the "Most High" so there is no reason for me to put him there.
Recognizing that Jesus had to be "Made Lord" aids in understanding WHY he IS Lord.Take heed!Even the name that is the only one that can save us under heaven was GIVEN him.Keep in mind the father's "equal" should NEVER have to be given anything at all,from a name,to a power,to a kingdom,to a revelation. God made him heir and loved him.
As For Jesus being Sovereign and Almighty,even if I surrendered that point it would only be possible because HIS God made him so which could only mean he would STILL not be the SAME TRUE GOD his father is OR equal as his authority is that which had to be gifted from a superior.God has no superiors,certainly not within his own "being"! God works through Christ's agency by means of the holy spirit so powerfully that Jesus can do what his father does if his father grants it.(acts 2:22,John 3:34)If it's not granted to Jesus or GIVEN him from his own God,Jesus wouldn't have anything at all,excluding the possibility that he is the true God.He lives BECAUSE of his father no?(John 5:26)And forever now because the One he said was greater and the only One good(without any qualification that only his "flesh" was speaking and not his ENTIRE person as the Christ of God..no inference needed) raised him from a genuine death.
Acts 2:32 This Jesus God resurrected, of which fact we are all witnesses. 36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know for a certainty that God made him both Lord and Christ'
So again,WHY is Jesus Lord,WHY is he savior, and WHY is he alive at all?
As for absolute statements in scripture,they are sometimes qualified in other texts ..For instance,Jehovah is the ONLY savior BUT
1 samuel 23:5:David was the saviour of the people of Keilah.(bible in basic English)
Judges 3:9:Then the people of Israel cried out to the LORD for help. The LORD sent a savior to rescue them. It was Othniel, son of Caleb's younger brother Kenaz.15The LORD sent a savior to rescue them. It was Ehud, a left-handed man from the tribe of Benjamin.(God's world translation)
Jude 25 to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus the Messiah(explains how they are both savior)
Sorry..I'm on some caffeine and got "long winded" ;)
Thanks for reading my blog!
SonOfAJewishCarpenter said...
you said:
" “…if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” —Rom. 10:9
I already covered how Jesus had to be MADE LORD and I confess that readily and without hesitation.I also confess that God raised him from death and that he is alive to plead for me now at God's right hand.Yet to Christians I'm not a christian at all.Interesting."
What is interesting about this comment is that you seem more interested in confessing that Jesus was MADE LORD more than you are in confessing him as YOUR LORD. Regardless of your oppinion of Him, He IS soverign over you and ALL of creation.
Jesus is the only One who can save people.
His name is the only power in the world
that has been given to save people.
We must be saved through him.
Acts 4:12
Jesus saith unto him,
I am the way, the truth, and the life:
no man cometh unto the Father, but by me;
John 14:6
I, even I, am the LORD;
and beside me there is no saviour.
Isa 43:11
SonOfAJewishCarpenter,
Thanks for your comment.The following is said assuming you're trinitarian..
Yes,Jesus had to be made Lord.And yes,he is my Lord.And no he couldn't have saved if he hadn't been sent forth to do so by his father.God so loved the world that he gave his special Son to die for us.I sincerely hope you understand the sacrifice Jesus's father made at least as much as the one his Son did.And that Jesus worships his father as the Only True God so there is no reason anyone else shouldn't.Jesus said "We worship what WE know.."..including himself as One who worships his father in spirit and truth.Does his father worship him?If not,there is no coequality.An Almighty God in no way logically would be worshipping someone else called Almighty God within his own "being"..That is unreasonable in the highest degree and not supported in scripture or explicitly stated anywhere.Also,that would equal two Almighties already regardless of what ANYONE says to make it "go away".Even if they share the SAME "substance" within the 1 "godhead" as separate individuals it would STILL equal 2 Almighty Gods.
I don't disagree with any scripture you provide.Jesus is absolutely the way,the truth,the life.His father used him to save us,making him mediator and king and Lord.Why shouldn't he?He's a proud father with an obedient faithful and inimitable Son he "approves",who is "beloved".The best proof Jesus was created ?He is called "God's Son."
John 10:34 Jesus answered them: “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I said: “you are gods”’? 35 If he called ‘gods’ those against whom the word of God came, and yet the Scripture cannot be nullified, 36 do you say to me whom the Father sanctified and dispatched into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, I am God’s Son?
"God's Son" would be HIGHLY illogical language to use for someone who IS "TRUE God".You won't find the bible itself stating that Jesus shares God's "essence" or "nature" as one of three persons in God's "being" so no one should formulate a doctrine to accomodate philosophies that support this.
I am not demoting Christ..I am recognizing his God-given position as the Second Most High over all the Universe,never said to exist within the same "being" as the "Most High" so there is no reason for me to put him there.
Recognizing that Jesus had to be "Made Lord" aids in understanding WHY he IS Lord.Take heed!Even the name that is the only one that can save us under heaven was GIVEN him.Keep in mind the father's "equal" should NEVER have to be given anything at all,from a name,to a power,to a kingdom,to a revelation. God made him heir and loved him.
As For Jesus being Sovereign and Almighty,even if I surrendered that point it would only be possible because HIS God made him so which could only mean he would STILL not be the SAME TRUE GOD his father is OR equal as his authority is that which had to be gifted from a superior.God has no superiors,certainly not within his own "being"! God works through Christ's agency by means of the holy spirit so powerfully that Jesus can do what his father does if his father grants it.(acts 2:22,John 3:34)If it's not granted to Jesus or GIVEN him from his own God,Jesus wouldn't have anything at all,excluding the possibility that he is the true God.He lives BECAUSE of his father no?(John 5:26)And forever now because the One he said was greater and the only One good(without any qualification that only his "flesh" was speaking and not his ENTIRE person as the Christ of God..no inference needed) raised him from a genuine death.
Acts 2:32 This Jesus God resurrected, of which fact we are all witnesses. 36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know for a certainty that God made him both Lord and Christ'
So again,WHY is Jesus Lord,WHY is he savior, and WHY is he alive at all?
As for absolute statements in scripture,they are sometimes qualified in other texts ..For instance,Jehovah is the ONLY savior BUT
1 samuel 23:5:David was the saviour of the people of Keilah.(bible in basic English)
Judges 3:9:Then the people of Israel cried out to the LORD for help. The LORD sent a savior to rescue them. It was Othniel, son of Caleb's younger brother Kenaz.15The LORD sent a savior to rescue them. It was Ehud, a left-handed man from the tribe of Benjamin.(God's world translation)
Jude 25 to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus the Messiah(explains how they are both savior)
Sorry..I'm on some caffeine and got "long winded" ;)
Thanks for reading my blog!
Tuesday, July 14, 2009
Jesus is...
I'm gonna do some scriptural hopping to find out the clear biblical formula as opposed to any creeds that were formulated in councils of men for who exactly Jesus is.
Everyone believing that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves whoever has been born of him. —1 John 5:1-5
The bible says that we can be born of God and that we are if we confess Christ and that God raised him from the dead ..So if we are born of God and we aren't the same God he is why is Christ if he is born of God as well?
Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God” —1 John 4:14, 15
And what does Son of God mean exactly?
Matthew 3:17 Look! Also, there was a voice from the heavens that said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved.”
John 10:36: do you say to me whom the Father sanctified and dispatched into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, I am God’s Son?
So Jesus is God's son and that is what son of God means. He is the most special one,made firstborn heir to a kingdom like no other but yet he remains a son.
Solomon, Adam, and Israel all sons of God in a special way.If God calls you his son it does not mean you are him but that he loves you dearly and you are favored.
One question I've heard is why did the Jews want to stone him for saying he was God's son if so many are..I can only assume because they thought he was somehow usurping God's sole rights but they were wrong.Scriptures let us know people were amazed that God had given such authority to a man!So no one thought he WAS GOD!They also knew he was making claims to be the Messiah but they simply didn't believe it.
He is “the apostle and high priest of our confession”—the “one mediator between God and men” (Heb. 3:1; 1 Tim. 2:5).
So here we have some more clear succint formulas of who Christ is ..high priest and mediator.
So he is high priest and high priests in scripture are to be served which does not make them God but those who have been appointed by God himself to be so.
According to the manner of Melchizedek is his priesthood..one that is not from appointment from man but from God and eternal once having begun.
“God has made this Jesus whom you crucified both Lord and Christ” —Acts 2:36
Interestingly,trinitarians have a God who had to be made Lord or his human nature did I should say which really doesn't make any sense at all since he is still one hundred percent man right?So why did his human nature have to be made Lord if he already was 100 percent God and his human nature supposedly retained nothing but humanity?Either his human nature is no longer really a human nature because it had to be made Lord supposedly again OR it is still 100 percent human as I've heard trinitarians say..Which is it?Both make moot of scripture..that Jesus was a perfect man who was exalted to the right hand of his father because he obeyed God not because he is God.
I'm probably inadvertantly misrepresenting something here in regards to the "2 natures" thing in my ditziness..if so,forgive me.
“…if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” —Rom. 10:9
I already covered how Jesus had to be MADE LORD and I confess that readily and without hesitation.I also confess that God raised him from death and that he is alive to plead for me now at God's right hand.Yet to Christians I'm not a christian at all.Interesting.
What does it mean when the bible says Jesus dies?How does the bible define death?.First let us establish that souls can die and be destroyed and perish.(Ez 18:4,Matt 10:28,James5:20)Having said that let's go further
Ecc 9:5:the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all(excluding the possibility that one is breathing moving or existing elsewhere)
Psalms 146:4: His spirit goes out, he goes
back to his ground;In that day his thoughts do perish.
So since Jesus died and this is God's definition of death there is no reason to think Jesus was anything but completely gone until his God raised him in the 3rd day.Any other confession is a manmade one based on philosophy of man and is frankly Gnostic..So on the third day God gave Christ back his spirit or his breath and animating force so that he could breathe move and live again.I confess this ..Do you?Do you confess that Christ was dead in a grave and not alive at all with no thoughts for 3 days?
Moving on..John lets us know why he wrote his book..why he wrote the book of John:
“These things are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you might have life in his name.” —John 20:31
Just because he has been appointed to a position that no other son has ever been exalted does not mean he is anything but God's most beloved exalted son.
Isaiah 11:1-3 "1. A shoot will come up from the stump of Jesse; from his roots a Branch will bear fruit.
2. The Spirit of the LORD will rest on him (Jesus)-- the Spirit of wisdom and of understanding, the Spirit of
counsel and of power, the Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD (Jesus fearing his GOD)--
3. and he will delight in the fear of the LORD. He will not judge by what he sees with his eyes, or
decide by what he hears with his ears;"
Matthew 12:18 "Here is my servant whom I have chosen, the one I love, in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him (Jesus), and he will proclaim justice to the nations."
So we know from these that God's spirit rests upon his awesome servant Jesus..Jesus is not a servant of his own being but a servant of his God who allows him to live and breathe and gives him his orders and will..
Acts 2:22 “Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus the Naz·a·rene´, a man publicly shown by God to you through powerful works and portents and signs that God did through him in your midst, just as you yourselves know, 24 But God resurrected him by loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to continue to be held fast by it.
So death held him fast for three days but did not continue to.As promised,his God raised him on the 3rd day.
Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified his Servant, Jesus
So again we have Jesus being nothing but DISTINGUISHED from the Most High of the OT as the most high's servant and son.never said to be a member of his being..anywhere ..ever..
Acts 3:22 In fact, Moses said, ‘Jehovah God will raise up for you from among your brothers a prophet like me. you must listen to him according to all the things he speaks to you. 23 Indeed, any soul that does not listen to that Prophet will be completely destroyed from among the people.’ 26 To you first God, after raising up his Servant, sent him forth to bless you by turning each one away from your wicked deeds.”
Here were more testimonies from God-breathed scripture who Jesus is.No need to infer anything further than what's given.
Daniel 7:13 “I kept on beholding in the visions of the night, and, see there! with the clouds of the heavens someone like a son of man happened to be coming; and to the Ancient of Days he gained access, and they brought him up close even before that One. 14 And to him there were given rulership and dignity and kingdom, that the peoples, national groups and languages should all serve even him. His rulership is an indefinitely lasting rulership that will not pass away, and his kingdom one that will not be brought to ruin.
So what we have here is a lovely picture of someone like the SON OF MAN being GIVEN a rulership from a loving father aka the Ancient of Days and being distinguished from that one as the one who had to be given what he has and would have to here be excluded from himself being the Ancient of Days unless you're willing to only be traditional and philosophical as opposed to succintly biblical..The Ancient of Days would be the supreme sovereign Lord of the universe the Most High Jehovah God almighty.. God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob God of my appointed king and consecrated Lord Jesus Christ..
Again I would like you ask why a human nature had to be given anything given the fact that it is still one hundred percent human and the God nature should've already had this.And has it ever stricken you as bizarre at all to blame every reliance and declaration of inferiority of Jesus's to a nature and not just Jesus himself,who never qualified this for us?
1 Corinthians 15:27 For God “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that it is with the exception of the one who subjected all things to him. 28 But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.
Let's never forget to praise the God of Jesus Christ and let us cease to worship anyone else as the same God who is the God of Jesus Christ.
John 17:3:. This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of you, the only true God, and of the one whom you sent forth, Jesus Christ.
And this isn't a "joint object" as I've heard James White say or two persons existing in the same God as trinitarians boldly say but a father who is the only true God and his son who he sent forth to save us who will always serve him and worship him as his one and only True Most High God.And because of Jesus faith obedience and goodness and love God has exalted him to be our Lord and King and second most high over all the universe..Praise God for his power to do this.Praise Jesus for his exalted status and love and goodness and exceptionalness..Praise Jesus for all the same reasons that God blessed his most exalted servant and son.Because God loves him and tells us to.Because he is deserving king and Lord.
So if you're the one who thinks that these statements and BIBLICALLY based "givens" are not good enough "formulas" for who Christ really is then I would say you have a problem with scripture itself ..If Jesus being called God on a literal few occasions in a representational and authoritative sense,authority that he had to be GIVEN cannot be reconciled in your mind with the sheer irrefutable Jewish Monotheism without having to add 2 persons to God's "being" then imo there's a problem.In light of the clear and tenable proof that there is precedent in scripture for others to bear the name of God and the title of God that he places within them. They are acting on his behalf.If they have been given power from the Most High himself.
3 simple truths..1.No one may see God and live.Jesus has been seen and not just in manifestations and agents revealing him but literally seen and people continued to live.2.God cannot die and Jesus can and did.3.Calling someone who is God "God's son" would be misleading and ridiculous.
Reminds me of Jesus saying we need to be like children..I knew as a child God's son wasn't God and told the preachers around me..I did not listen to them when they insisted he was.I knew it wasn't possible.And quickly recognized scriptural precedent for others bearing the title god..And doesn't the bible say that the kingdom belongs to childlike ones?Is it really appropriate to not trust that God would've revealed a distinctive formula so we would at least know he was three persons?Even IF we couldn't grasp it?Do you really think he wanted to conceal his identity of a composition of three persons so that 400 yrs later trinitarians could arrogantly proclaim that you cannot know who he is except through divine revelation and that we should not question this "orthodox" "truth" and are in fact threatened with title "heretic" and "cultist" if we do.Suddenly the logic and reason and truth seeking God endowed and blessed me with isn't valid and must be ignored?Suddenly I am unchristian for only being willing to confess Christ as Messiah,Son of the Living God?
For those of you who condemn people like me to either hell or something else for not confessing that Christ is the second person of a triune God then your condemnation is unfounded given my ready willingness to confess that Christ is the beloved most exalted of God's sons who has been anointed as Christ by the God he himself serves and worships ...all I can say is..who are you to judge someone for confessing what the bible says we must confess for salvation and then telling me I have none?
Now the scriptures I've provided are the overwhelming testimony of Christ's identity.The trinity "proof texts" are never clear and can all be found wanting even in the "orthodox" community itself..conflicting views and interpretations..So when you have a doctrine that forces you to infer,be dogmatic about irrefutably precarious texts to formulate doctrine not even based on scriptural terms,and throw reason by the wayside while embracing philosophical terminology the bible never uses..then houston we have a problemo.
In conclusion,Jesus is :1.High Priest..2.Appointed as Lord..3.Mediator..4.The Christ of God..4.God's Son..5.servant of and beloved One of God...6.Second only to God and worthy of our confession, faith, and honor.
Everyone believing that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves whoever has been born of him. —1 John 5:1-5
The bible says that we can be born of God and that we are if we confess Christ and that God raised him from the dead ..So if we are born of God and we aren't the same God he is why is Christ if he is born of God as well?
Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God” —1 John 4:14, 15
And what does Son of God mean exactly?
Matthew 3:17 Look! Also, there was a voice from the heavens that said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved.”
John 10:36: do you say to me whom the Father sanctified and dispatched into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, I am God’s Son?
So Jesus is God's son and that is what son of God means. He is the most special one,made firstborn heir to a kingdom like no other but yet he remains a son.
Solomon, Adam, and Israel all sons of God in a special way.If God calls you his son it does not mean you are him but that he loves you dearly and you are favored.
One question I've heard is why did the Jews want to stone him for saying he was God's son if so many are..I can only assume because they thought he was somehow usurping God's sole rights but they were wrong.Scriptures let us know people were amazed that God had given such authority to a man!So no one thought he WAS GOD!They also knew he was making claims to be the Messiah but they simply didn't believe it.
He is “the apostle and high priest of our confession”—the “one mediator between God and men” (Heb. 3:1; 1 Tim. 2:5).
So here we have some more clear succint formulas of who Christ is ..high priest and mediator.
So he is high priest and high priests in scripture are to be served which does not make them God but those who have been appointed by God himself to be so.
According to the manner of Melchizedek is his priesthood..one that is not from appointment from man but from God and eternal once having begun.
“God has made this Jesus whom you crucified both Lord and Christ” —Acts 2:36
Interestingly,trinitarians have a God who had to be made Lord or his human nature did I should say which really doesn't make any sense at all since he is still one hundred percent man right?So why did his human nature have to be made Lord if he already was 100 percent God and his human nature supposedly retained nothing but humanity?Either his human nature is no longer really a human nature because it had to be made Lord supposedly again OR it is still 100 percent human as I've heard trinitarians say..Which is it?Both make moot of scripture..that Jesus was a perfect man who was exalted to the right hand of his father because he obeyed God not because he is God.
I'm probably inadvertantly misrepresenting something here in regards to the "2 natures" thing in my ditziness..if so,forgive me.
“…if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” —Rom. 10:9
I already covered how Jesus had to be MADE LORD and I confess that readily and without hesitation.I also confess that God raised him from death and that he is alive to plead for me now at God's right hand.Yet to Christians I'm not a christian at all.Interesting.
What does it mean when the bible says Jesus dies?How does the bible define death?.First let us establish that souls can die and be destroyed and perish.(Ez 18:4,Matt 10:28,James5:20)Having said that let's go further
Ecc 9:5:the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all(excluding the possibility that one is breathing moving or existing elsewhere)
Psalms 146:4: His spirit goes out, he goes
back to his ground;In that day his thoughts do perish.
So since Jesus died and this is God's definition of death there is no reason to think Jesus was anything but completely gone until his God raised him in the 3rd day.Any other confession is a manmade one based on philosophy of man and is frankly Gnostic..So on the third day God gave Christ back his spirit or his breath and animating force so that he could breathe move and live again.I confess this ..Do you?Do you confess that Christ was dead in a grave and not alive at all with no thoughts for 3 days?
Moving on..John lets us know why he wrote his book..why he wrote the book of John:
“These things are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you might have life in his name.” —John 20:31
Just because he has been appointed to a position that no other son has ever been exalted does not mean he is anything but God's most beloved exalted son.
Isaiah 11:1-3 "1. A shoot will come up from the stump of Jesse; from his roots a Branch will bear fruit.
2. The Spirit of the LORD will rest on him (Jesus)-- the Spirit of wisdom and of understanding, the Spirit of
counsel and of power, the Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD (Jesus fearing his GOD)--
3. and he will delight in the fear of the LORD. He will not judge by what he sees with his eyes, or
decide by what he hears with his ears;"
Matthew 12:18 "Here is my servant whom I have chosen, the one I love, in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him (Jesus), and he will proclaim justice to the nations."
So we know from these that God's spirit rests upon his awesome servant Jesus..Jesus is not a servant of his own being but a servant of his God who allows him to live and breathe and gives him his orders and will..
Acts 2:22 “Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus the Naz·a·rene´, a man publicly shown by God to you through powerful works and portents and signs that God did through him in your midst, just as you yourselves know, 24 But God resurrected him by loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to continue to be held fast by it.
So death held him fast for three days but did not continue to.As promised,his God raised him on the 3rd day.
Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified his Servant, Jesus
So again we have Jesus being nothing but DISTINGUISHED from the Most High of the OT as the most high's servant and son.never said to be a member of his being..anywhere ..ever..
Acts 3:22 In fact, Moses said, ‘Jehovah God will raise up for you from among your brothers a prophet like me. you must listen to him according to all the things he speaks to you. 23 Indeed, any soul that does not listen to that Prophet will be completely destroyed from among the people.’ 26 To you first God, after raising up his Servant, sent him forth to bless you by turning each one away from your wicked deeds.”
Here were more testimonies from God-breathed scripture who Jesus is.No need to infer anything further than what's given.
Daniel 7:13 “I kept on beholding in the visions of the night, and, see there! with the clouds of the heavens someone like a son of man happened to be coming; and to the Ancient of Days he gained access, and they brought him up close even before that One. 14 And to him there were given rulership and dignity and kingdom, that the peoples, national groups and languages should all serve even him. His rulership is an indefinitely lasting rulership that will not pass away, and his kingdom one that will not be brought to ruin.
So what we have here is a lovely picture of someone like the SON OF MAN being GIVEN a rulership from a loving father aka the Ancient of Days and being distinguished from that one as the one who had to be given what he has and would have to here be excluded from himself being the Ancient of Days unless you're willing to only be traditional and philosophical as opposed to succintly biblical..The Ancient of Days would be the supreme sovereign Lord of the universe the Most High Jehovah God almighty.. God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob God of my appointed king and consecrated Lord Jesus Christ..
Again I would like you ask why a human nature had to be given anything given the fact that it is still one hundred percent human and the God nature should've already had this.And has it ever stricken you as bizarre at all to blame every reliance and declaration of inferiority of Jesus's to a nature and not just Jesus himself,who never qualified this for us?
1 Corinthians 15:27 For God “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that it is with the exception of the one who subjected all things to him. 28 But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.
Let's never forget to praise the God of Jesus Christ and let us cease to worship anyone else as the same God who is the God of Jesus Christ.
John 17:3:. This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of you, the only true God, and of the one whom you sent forth, Jesus Christ.
And this isn't a "joint object" as I've heard James White say or two persons existing in the same God as trinitarians boldly say but a father who is the only true God and his son who he sent forth to save us who will always serve him and worship him as his one and only True Most High God.And because of Jesus faith obedience and goodness and love God has exalted him to be our Lord and King and second most high over all the universe..Praise God for his power to do this.Praise Jesus for his exalted status and love and goodness and exceptionalness..Praise Jesus for all the same reasons that God blessed his most exalted servant and son.Because God loves him and tells us to.Because he is deserving king and Lord.
So if you're the one who thinks that these statements and BIBLICALLY based "givens" are not good enough "formulas" for who Christ really is then I would say you have a problem with scripture itself ..If Jesus being called God on a literal few occasions in a representational and authoritative sense,authority that he had to be GIVEN cannot be reconciled in your mind with the sheer irrefutable Jewish Monotheism without having to add 2 persons to God's "being" then imo there's a problem.In light of the clear and tenable proof that there is precedent in scripture for others to bear the name of God and the title of God that he places within them. They are acting on his behalf.If they have been given power from the Most High himself.
3 simple truths..1.No one may see God and live.Jesus has been seen and not just in manifestations and agents revealing him but literally seen and people continued to live.2.God cannot die and Jesus can and did.3.Calling someone who is God "God's son" would be misleading and ridiculous.
Reminds me of Jesus saying we need to be like children..I knew as a child God's son wasn't God and told the preachers around me..I did not listen to them when they insisted he was.I knew it wasn't possible.And quickly recognized scriptural precedent for others bearing the title god..And doesn't the bible say that the kingdom belongs to childlike ones?Is it really appropriate to not trust that God would've revealed a distinctive formula so we would at least know he was three persons?Even IF we couldn't grasp it?Do you really think he wanted to conceal his identity of a composition of three persons so that 400 yrs later trinitarians could arrogantly proclaim that you cannot know who he is except through divine revelation and that we should not question this "orthodox" "truth" and are in fact threatened with title "heretic" and "cultist" if we do.Suddenly the logic and reason and truth seeking God endowed and blessed me with isn't valid and must be ignored?Suddenly I am unchristian for only being willing to confess Christ as Messiah,Son of the Living God?
For those of you who condemn people like me to either hell or something else for not confessing that Christ is the second person of a triune God then your condemnation is unfounded given my ready willingness to confess that Christ is the beloved most exalted of God's sons who has been anointed as Christ by the God he himself serves and worships ...all I can say is..who are you to judge someone for confessing what the bible says we must confess for salvation and then telling me I have none?
Now the scriptures I've provided are the overwhelming testimony of Christ's identity.The trinity "proof texts" are never clear and can all be found wanting even in the "orthodox" community itself..conflicting views and interpretations..So when you have a doctrine that forces you to infer,be dogmatic about irrefutably precarious texts to formulate doctrine not even based on scriptural terms,and throw reason by the wayside while embracing philosophical terminology the bible never uses..then houston we have a problemo.
In conclusion,Jesus is :1.High Priest..2.Appointed as Lord..3.Mediator..4.The Christ of God..4.God's Son..5.servant of and beloved One of God...6.Second only to God and worthy of our confession, faith, and honor.
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