In defense of the failed watchtower dates set in the past for all those events that they erroneously foretold,all the while attributing them to God in various phraseologies,you will often hear Jehovah's Witnesses defend the society,saying that the organization never said they were infallible or inspired.JW's will absolutely break out a plethora of quotes to prove that these men said they "did not know" and hence are NOT false prophets.I was one of those Jehovah's witnesses.I even wrote a blog defending them pertinaciously in regards to these matters.I was ill informed,however and decided to remove that particular blog.Here's why.And much of this is inspired by or taken directly from the HIGHLY recommended,especially for Jehovah's Witnesses,book "Crisis of Conscience" written by former governing body member Raymond Franz,a meek and well intentioned Christian who wanted to expose the hypocrisy and injustice,having witnessed it closely himself,within the society's operations.I want to make a very serious point for the Jehovah's witnesses reading this..I mean this earnestly& sincerely.You are NOT reading a book that will kill you more quickly then pornography would if you read this book.You are reading something that may save you from "putting your trust in men,in whom no salvation belongs".It is a MUST read.Don't let anyone stop you!And no it didn't cause me to disassociate from the society..I was already resolved to do that before I ever touched this book.What I found when I opened it was a man after my own heart,propagating truth and justice for those who I think he really loves,Jehovah's witnesses.Now I really don't need to go over the various dates that have been set by various men within the society,some of which didn't originate with the WT society or Charles Taze Russell but other men or sects from whom they just borrowed them,changing the meaning of them when their expectations weren't fulfilled after the dates had come and gone(because they had to!)..pushing dates forward or simply redefining what they mean,as they did with 1914.First it meant the absolute end..now it just means "invisible presence" which conveniently for them is impossible to disprove.It's like trying to disprove an imaginary friend.Suffice to say Jesus didn't preach it and if it is the good news of the kingdom then the apostles weren't preaching the good news of the kingdom..No need to add to the bible's succint good news with speculation.No need to keep haughtily setting dates when it reality you should've humbled yourself long ago and ceased from doing so,having been humiliated with falsely proclaiming them over and over in the past.The bible even lets us know it isn't up to us to know these things.
Acts 1:7:He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority."(Really,nothing more even needs to be said as powerful as Jesus's words are..)
Judge Rutherford said of his predictions about 1925,which was when he said Christ's millenial rule would be fully manifest on earth,"I know I made an ass of myself"
And to quote Ray Franz,as I will be doing frequently in blogs if I continue writing on this, as his words are much more eloquent than mine and his wisdom is far more pronounced ..
"It is one thing for a man to make an "ass" of himself because of wanting to see something happen.It is quite another thing for him to urge others to share his views,to criticize them if they do not,even to question their faith or impugn their motives if they do not see the matter as he sees it"..p 174,"Crisis of Conscience"
Now these points Franz makes are still very much relevant today.If you question 1914,you aren't just questioning men or an organization,you are questioning "Jehovah's sole channel of communication","Jehovah's appointed faithful and discreet slave class".You suddenly get to bear titles that would degrade anyone's integrity were they true such as "apostate","spiritually weak","worldy" ,"the walking dead","bad association" etc,especially with no eventual conformity.In other words,to question the society is thought of as the equivalent of questioning God himself,ultimately.The literature encourages this thinking.As will be evidenced later in other blogs as I reveal more realities Franz exposes within the organization.Ray goes on to say,and I think this information is relevant when JW's tell us the apostles had the SAME KINDS of premature expectations as they did.Please keep in mind the apostles ASKED Christ what was going to happen as opposed to claiming it as God's proclamation and proceeding to propagate it to countless people for decades..numerous times.
"It is still more serious for an organization representing itself as God's appointed spokesman to all mankind to do this--and to do it,not for a few days or months,but for years,even decades,repeatedly,on an earthwide basis.This kind of responsibility CANNOT be shrugged off by saying "well..nobody's perfect"..No one is but everyone of us bears a responsibility for what we do.And that is especially so when our actions may dramatically affect something as important and personal as others' relationship with God...No less serious is it when a group of men have DIVIDED views on predictions related to a certain date and yet present to their adherents an outward appearance of UNITED confidence,encouraging those adherents to place unwavering trust in those predictions"..p174 ,"Crisis of Conscience"
From these revelations from a former governing body member himself,we can discern that the WT is far from honest or at least certainly hides information,giving false impressions.We are expected to assume that Christ is working through each anointed member of the governing body and that they would be in full agreement on every matter before they force us to,but no..they are divided..Again,this screams injustice!How can we trust divided opinions to be from God?And why are we expected to adhere to an opinion that the bible isn't clear enough about for a few men to all agree on it because it isn't a succint bible belief,presented indisputably?How in the world could someone justifiably not be considered a real acceptable saved sheep for questioning something that precarious?If God is a God of justice and his sheep in the past have questioned these men's PROVEN lies and were punished in whatever way for it,why would that be acceptable to God?
Observe the following quotes from the WT magazine.I think they are beyond revealing and should be acknowledged by JW's in application to themselves as opposed to being applied to everyone BUT themselves.I repeat :the JW's should not be exempt from their own standards!How would that be fair?Again,God hates hypocrisy and DEMANDS fairness.
from April 1,1972 Watchtower
"Of course,it is easy to see that this group acts as a "prophet" of God.It is another thing to prove it.The only way that this can be done is to review the record.What does it show?"
Well,when I review the record I find men who have falsely made predictions that they said were God's dates while saying that they were acting as God's mouthpiece and God's channel of communication,saying that to question their speculations would be the equivalent of questioning God and Christ(proof below),then when their lies didn't come to pass blaming it again on God.Never truly repenting but instead using propagandist language to make the "rank and file" believe that they never did anything wrong at all.
One example of comparing questioning them to questioning the Lord:
from May 1,1922 WT
"To repudiate him(Charles Russell) is the equivalent to a repudiation of the Lord."
Yikes.Check out this one
May 15 1922 WT
"the Lord has placed the stamp of his seal upon 1914 and 1918 beyond any possibility of erasure."
from May 1 ,1997 Watchtower
"Jehovah God is the Grand Identifier of his true messengers.He identifies them by making the messages he delivers through them come true.Jehovah is also the Great Exposer of false messengers.He frustrates their signs and predictions.In this way he shows that they are self appointed prognosticators,whose messages really spring from their own false reasoning--yes,their foolish,fleshly thinking!"
Wow!That's from 1997.Amazing.And I am seriously not trying to be sarcastic.I am just stunned.
Suffice to say that all the events that supposedly took place in 1914 acc to the JW's today were attributed to DIFFERENT dates in the past .I have no idea at this point why this one lasted at all after "reviewing the record".In 1874 they said the end would come..it didn't .So instead "Christ's invisible presence" did.The end was also supposed to occur in 1914 and since it didn't "Christ's invisible presence" did..Notice a pattern here?"New light" seems to flash usually when a false prediction doesn't come to pass and is forced upon the society as opposed to any honestly genuine enlightening truth from Jehovah through Christ.I would urge anyone to hesitate before presuming this date came straight from God.Remember,do what the WT says and first "review the record" to make sure.What do YOU find?
More on this later.
Sunday, December 27, 2009
Sunday, December 13, 2009
Disassociation
I recently disassociated myself from the Jehovah's witnesses.Just wanted to warn the JW's so they wouldn't think I am trying to mislead or fool them.Having been where they are and thought how they think and felt how they feel,I can honestly say that no matter how hideous they think I am right now,I love them from the bottom of my heart.Always will..And the best piece of advice I can offer them is to ponder WHY the society tells you constantly that any outside opinions and literature are poison.It is because the society could not stand under the light of the type of scrutiny and the brutal honesty you can find in books like "Crisis of Conscience" and "Captives of a Concept".Where would someone go if they aren't on the WT "ark"?To Jah through Christ,obviously.It is ok to home fellowship or seek somewhere less controlling and dogmatic about nonessential issues for worship(though it CAN be hard it's worth the effort to find a place or make one).And those who think that would be forming some kind of sect,well,the WT IS a sect from another sect etc.Congregating with fellow Christians who believe essential truths isn't forming a "sect".Questioning men who have been detrimentally wrong too many times to count is NOT the equivalent of questioning Jehovah as they would have you believe.And them having you believe that is the equivalent of imprisoning your mind to be susceptible to anything they want to plant there.It takes a WHILE to break free.First come the nagging smaller doubts.Then come the disturbing discoveries that JW's push out of their minds by reading more and more bias WT literature or being afraid of losing everyone they love.Then if one remains objective unbias and continually studious and fair minded,one discovers the inconsistencies and outright lies within the org till it breaks you down and leads you to Christ who ALONE can save you with sayings of everlasting life.No organization of fallible and inconsistent men can,especially if those men are going to require you believe them even when something may be false in order to remain "saved" and "unshunned" and "acceptable".In other words,they expect followers to accept what they say as if God said it even if it is speculative at best(1914 anyone?) and then proceed to say they are fallible.Those two concepts are incongruent..Now there are obvious succint truths in scripture regarding Jesus being the savior,the Christ,the Son of the living God.His father being the ONLY TRUE God,and God being love and the wicked perishing(hell is a lie).Christ's actually dying(ALL of him) and being raised on the 3rd day..the earth being inhabited forever by the meek and righteous..these are clear.."Interpretive possibilities" should NOT be dogmatically enforced beliefs.I realize there are many fantastic things about JW's and about the literature.I understand their views on holidays,war,essential truths etc are all good ..but there is too much bad mixed in.Think of Christmas.There are beautiful lights,trees,gifts,family dinners,warm fuzzy feelings of sharing and closeness etc..but there are DARK truths beneath the surface,no?Well that is how I will classify the WT organization for now.Bad analogy..just trying to think of a way to express it.As hard as it will be after reading the bible WITH WT literature for so long,I recommend JW's read the bible ALONE for a while..things will pop out you never noticed before and certain WT teachings and strong assertions and repeated declarations will start to appear questionable.Their overuse of "faithful and discreet slave class","organization for salvation","new light","past truths"(that were REALLY lies),1914,"Jehovah's sole channel of communication"(while still saying they are fallible..again,incongruent concepts),"other sheep class","anointed class","watchtower ark",being unable to actually BE born again,passing around bread and wine that you will only deny,etc...these should all be examined meticulously without watchtower literature.It is an uncomfortable feeling being confused and not having answers about many of the things I thought I knew before,but it's a process.And I darn well know Jesus will not say to me EVER
"I never knew you!!Get away from me you worker of lawlessness!You wouldn't preach 1914 even though the men who set the date were wrong about all the other dates they had set before it!!You are none of my sheep!"
Yet,that is what the WT is willing to do.Disturbing.And unfortunately,that's just one of a number of qualms.I won't lie and say I'm in a comfortable place right now..that I know everything and feel I've found some greater truth..I only know the thought of implicitly trusting men to guide me to salvation and being forced to adhere to their every whim and speculation is a scary thought.I have a hard journey ahead seeking truth and finding my place but as long as I think of God before I think of me(because I rarely feel like doing what is right) I will be ok.
Btw,I will leave the pro-Jehovah's witnesses blogs up because I feel some of the information is still relevant and besides,it is always good to know how they defend themselves.
"I never knew you!!Get away from me you worker of lawlessness!You wouldn't preach 1914 even though the men who set the date were wrong about all the other dates they had set before it!!You are none of my sheep!"
Yet,that is what the WT is willing to do.Disturbing.And unfortunately,that's just one of a number of qualms.I won't lie and say I'm in a comfortable place right now..that I know everything and feel I've found some greater truth..I only know the thought of implicitly trusting men to guide me to salvation and being forced to adhere to their every whim and speculation is a scary thought.I have a hard journey ahead seeking truth and finding my place but as long as I think of God before I think of me(because I rarely feel like doing what is right) I will be ok.
Btw,I will leave the pro-Jehovah's witnesses blogs up because I feel some of the information is still relevant and besides,it is always good to know how they defend themselves.
Wednesday, December 9, 2009
The truth about Hellfire
This was in a debate about hell between Dan Mages,Steve Scianni,and Patrick Navas with Gene Cook and 2 other traditionalists.I will provide the link for Dan Mages' podcasts where I found this.Dan Mages and Steve Scianni are speaking in these portions(you can listen to the whole thing on the link..just click on the podcast about hell..obviously)
http://hungertruth.com/Podcast.php
I am amazed and appalled at the traditionalists' attack on these 3 men(in the entirety of the debate.this is what ppl do when thay have no REAL biblical defense..they tell you you don't have the holy spirit to help you understand God's son is God or the wicked won't just perish) just because they take words like consumed destroyed death and perish literally,taking the LITERAL few scriptures that supposedly prove the "hellfire" doctrine in context of the OT scriptures that explain their symbolism..If you're a Christian watching this,it is time to wake up..You don't know who you worship!God is love.If he tells you that immortal worms and unquenchable fire are on CARCASSES and that eternal fire means DESTRUCTION and that weeping and gnashing of teeth means anger (which would be normal when one is being judged!)and that the CONSEQUENCES of nouns of action when paired with "eternal" are generally what's eternal as opposed to the action itself(eternal sin,eternal judgment,eternal destruction etc) then you should listen.And it doesn't matter who or what someone is,if they are trying to help you understand that immortality is a GIFT that does not BELONG to the wicked and that souls can die.these are biblical facts.Like I said,time to wake up.
My question to you is..are you going to take what the bible teaches clearly and irrefutably from Genesis to Revelation..that the wicked shall perish and return to dust OR are you going to take a literal few symbolic texts that you think prove something that the bible explains in OT passages(yes folks..the symbolism is explained for you) literally and call it justice when temporary sin that we INHERITED is punished with a literal eternal fire(that the bible says means destruction) and then profess to know that God is love and tempers his justice with mercy and shall make a world anew where mourning and sin and death will exist NOWHERE?Seriously?As an orthodox believer,you believe he will extend mourning and sin and "eternal dying" forever after.That is incongruent with his plans to reveal his glory and his promised way of doing so!By eliminating all the things you think he will preserve.
If you ignore blatant logic and explicit biblical statements like the fate God promised Adam then don't be surprised if God questions your perception of him and the definition of justice and love and reason.If you take symbolic hyperbolic passages literally and proclaim that gehenna preserved what was thrown in it alive,don't be surprised if God exposes your reliance upon tradition instead of fact and reason and truth.I say all this not to seem pushy or shattering of long held traditions that are difficult to sever but simply to point out the truth that MUST be embraced in order to properly understand God and his Son and their kingdom.Admittedly,this orthodox belief confounds me in a most disturbing way.Not because I don't WANT to accept what the bible teaches,but because I understand what it does and consider this teaching blasphemous,a grand and inexcusable error.
http://hungertruth.com/Podcast.php
I am amazed and appalled at the traditionalists' attack on these 3 men(in the entirety of the debate.this is what ppl do when thay have no REAL biblical defense..they tell you you don't have the holy spirit to help you understand God's son is God or the wicked won't just perish) just because they take words like consumed destroyed death and perish literally,taking the LITERAL few scriptures that supposedly prove the "hellfire" doctrine in context of the OT scriptures that explain their symbolism..If you're a Christian watching this,it is time to wake up..You don't know who you worship!God is love.If he tells you that immortal worms and unquenchable fire are on CARCASSES and that eternal fire means DESTRUCTION and that weeping and gnashing of teeth means anger (which would be normal when one is being judged!)and that the CONSEQUENCES of nouns of action when paired with "eternal" are generally what's eternal as opposed to the action itself(eternal sin,eternal judgment,eternal destruction etc) then you should listen.And it doesn't matter who or what someone is,if they are trying to help you understand that immortality is a GIFT that does not BELONG to the wicked and that souls can die.these are biblical facts.Like I said,time to wake up.
My question to you is..are you going to take what the bible teaches clearly and irrefutably from Genesis to Revelation..that the wicked shall perish and return to dust OR are you going to take a literal few symbolic texts that you think prove something that the bible explains in OT passages(yes folks..the symbolism is explained for you) literally and call it justice when temporary sin that we INHERITED is punished with a literal eternal fire(that the bible says means destruction) and then profess to know that God is love and tempers his justice with mercy and shall make a world anew where mourning and sin and death will exist NOWHERE?Seriously?As an orthodox believer,you believe he will extend mourning and sin and "eternal dying" forever after.That is incongruent with his plans to reveal his glory and his promised way of doing so!By eliminating all the things you think he will preserve.
If you ignore blatant logic and explicit biblical statements like the fate God promised Adam then don't be surprised if God questions your perception of him and the definition of justice and love and reason.If you take symbolic hyperbolic passages literally and proclaim that gehenna preserved what was thrown in it alive,don't be surprised if God exposes your reliance upon tradition instead of fact and reason and truth.I say all this not to seem pushy or shattering of long held traditions that are difficult to sever but simply to point out the truth that MUST be embraced in order to properly understand God and his Son and their kingdom.Admittedly,this orthodox belief confounds me in a most disturbing way.Not because I don't WANT to accept what the bible teaches,but because I understand what it does and consider this teaching blasphemous,a grand and inexcusable error.
Saturday, December 5, 2009
The Discipline of Pain
This is an excerpt from the book :"The Life of Paul" by F.B Meyer
It is a great little book,highly recommended,poetic and encouraging.Thought I would share an excerpt that touched me personally..and this book is full of touching words.
This was written in regards to Paul's visit to the Third Paradise(2 Cor 12:2,4-5)(which the author here thinks was Paul because Paul reveals that by reasons of the visions and revelations granted him that there was danger of his being exalted overmuch.Whether it was Paul or not,the ultimate message here is still relevant and poignant.)
To Such,Bridal Moments come
Paradise would indeed be a poor place if words could describe it.The third heaven would not be worthy of its Maker if its glories did not transcend our furthest imaginings.He hath set eternity in our heart,a capacity for the infinite,a yearning after the divine.In moments of reverie,when stirred by certain notes in music,when under the spell of a sunset on a summer's eve,when we wake up to love,we know that words are but the token of thought,the signs and symbols of realities,and not the realities.Translate into words for me the sighings of the wind through the forest and the withdrawal of the sea down a pebbly beach and the string of sunlight playing on the hyacinth-strewn grass.You cannot!Then you know why the apostle described his experiences in Paradise as unspeakable.
But these hours are as fading as they are unspeakable.Why?Lest we should be exalted above measure and become proud.If the apostle feared this,much more should we!Lest we should come to trust in an experience as an aim or object of life instead of regarding it as God's will and testimony that He may withhold if we make more of it than we ought.We must live not in an experience but in Jesus,from whom,as from the sun,all lovely and helpful experiences emanate.Lest we should get out of touch with men and women around us,the majority of whom do not live on mountain tops but reside in valleys,where demons possess and worry the afflicted.
Through God's wise providence, such radiant hours do not linger,because our strength is not fed with them.We shall not get much working strength out of whipped cream,however pleasant it tastes;and if we rely on the raptures of Paradise for our sources of spiritual power,we shall come lamentable short of our true reinforcements.So God,in His mercy,gives them once or twice,now and again,and,at the time of sending them,accompanies them with a thorn that we may be reminded of our utter weakness and helplessness and be driven to avail ourselves of His grace,in which alone is our sufficiency.
Do not expect the vision of Paradise to linger;it would dazzle you and make life unnatural and unreal.Do not regret the passage of the blessed ,rapturous hours,light of step and fleet of pace.Do not think that you have fallen from grace when their flush and glow are over.Whether they come to you constantly or not,or even if they never visit you,you are still in Christ,still joined to the Lord,still accepted in the Beloved;and neither height of rapture,nor depth of depression shall ever separate you from the love of God that is in Jesus Christ our Lord.Be content,then,to turn,as Jesus did,from the rapture of Paradise,presented on the Transfiguration Mount,to take the way of the cross through which you will become able to open Paradise to souls in despair ,like the dying thief.
The Discipline of Pain
Paul's "thorn" must have been VERY painful.In infinite wisdom,God permitted the messenger of Satan to buffet his servant,and all through that first missionary journey,Paul had to face a long succession of buffetings.There were perils of robbers,of waters,of mountain passes,and of violent crowds;but in addition to all,there was the lacerating thorn.
Paul could have suffered from weak eyes or some distressing form of opthamalia.We infer this from the eagerness of his Galatian converts to give him their eyes,from his dependence on an amanuensis,and from the clumsy letters with which he wrote the postscripts to his epistles(Gal 6:11)..And if this were the case,the pain would be greatly aggravated as he faced the keen blasts that swept the mountain plateau on which the Pisidian Antioch was situated.
Was it during this journey that Paul sought the Lord on three separate occasions for deliverance and received the assurance that though the thorn were left,more than sufficient grace would be given(2 Corinthians 12:9)?If so,like a peal of bells,at Antioch,Iconium,Derbe, and Lystra,he must have heard the music of those tender words:My grace is sufficient,sufficient,SUFFICIENT for you!Sufficient when friends forsake and foes pursue;sufficient to make you strong against a raging synagogue or a shower of stones;sufficient for excessive labors of body and conflicts of soul,sufficient to enable you to do as much work,and even more,than if the body were perfectly whole--for my strength is made perfect only amid the conditions of mortal weakness.
In estimating the greatness of a man's lifework,it is fair to take into consideration the difficulties under which the man has accomplished it.And how greatly does our appreciation of the apostle rise when we remember that he was incessantly in pain.Instead,however,of sitting down in despair and pleading physical infirmity as his excuse for doing nothing,he bravely claimed the grace that waited within and did greater work through God's enabling power than he could have done through his own had it been unhindered by his weakness.
Ah,afflicted ones,your disabilities were meant to unite with God's enablings,your weakness to mate his Power.Do not sit before that mistaken marriage,that uncongenial business,that unfortunate partnership,that physical weakness,that hesitancy of speech,that disfigurement of face,as though it must necessarily maim and conquer you.God's grace is at hand--sufficient--and at its best when human weakness is most profound.Appropriate it and learn that those who wait on God are stronger in their weakness than sons of men in their stoutest health and vigor.
*Romans 8:35 Who will separate us from the love of the Christ? Will tribulation or distress or persecution or hunger or nakedness or danger or sword? 36 Just as it is written: “For your sake we are being put to death all day long, we have been accounted as sheep for slaughtering.” 37 To the contrary, in all these things we are coming off completely victorious through him that loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life nor angels nor governments nor things now here nor things to come nor powers 39 nor height nor depth nor any other creation will be able to separate us from God’s love that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
*Hebrews 12:11 True, no discipline seems for the present to be joyous, but grievous; yet afterward to those who have been trained by it it yields peaceable fruit, namely, righteousness. 12 Hence straighten up the hands that hang down and the enfeebled knees, 13 and keep making straight paths for your feet, that what is lame may not be put out of joint, but rather that it may be healed.
*2 Corinthians 12:6 For if I ever do want to boast, I shall not be unreasonable, for I shall say the truth. But I abstain, in order that no one should put to my credit more than what he sees I am or he hears from me, 7 just because of the excess of the revelations. Therefore, that I might not feel overly exalted, there was given me a thorn in the flesh, an angel of Satan, to keep slapping me, that I might not be overly exalted. 8 In this behalf I three times entreated the Lord that it might depart from me; 9 and yet he really said to me: “My undeserved kindness is sufficient for you; for [my] power is being made perfect in weakness.” Most gladly, therefore, will I rather boast as respects my weaknesses, that the power of the Christ may like a tent remain over me. 10 Therefore I take pleasure in weaknesses, in insults, in cases of need, in persecutions and difficulties, for Christ. For when I am weak, then I am powerful.
It is a great little book,highly recommended,poetic and encouraging.Thought I would share an excerpt that touched me personally..and this book is full of touching words.
This was written in regards to Paul's visit to the Third Paradise(2 Cor 12:2,4-5)(which the author here thinks was Paul because Paul reveals that by reasons of the visions and revelations granted him that there was danger of his being exalted overmuch.Whether it was Paul or not,the ultimate message here is still relevant and poignant.)
To Such,Bridal Moments come
Paradise would indeed be a poor place if words could describe it.The third heaven would not be worthy of its Maker if its glories did not transcend our furthest imaginings.He hath set eternity in our heart,a capacity for the infinite,a yearning after the divine.In moments of reverie,when stirred by certain notes in music,when under the spell of a sunset on a summer's eve,when we wake up to love,we know that words are but the token of thought,the signs and symbols of realities,and not the realities.Translate into words for me the sighings of the wind through the forest and the withdrawal of the sea down a pebbly beach and the string of sunlight playing on the hyacinth-strewn grass.You cannot!Then you know why the apostle described his experiences in Paradise as unspeakable.
But these hours are as fading as they are unspeakable.Why?Lest we should be exalted above measure and become proud.If the apostle feared this,much more should we!Lest we should come to trust in an experience as an aim or object of life instead of regarding it as God's will and testimony that He may withhold if we make more of it than we ought.We must live not in an experience but in Jesus,from whom,as from the sun,all lovely and helpful experiences emanate.Lest we should get out of touch with men and women around us,the majority of whom do not live on mountain tops but reside in valleys,where demons possess and worry the afflicted.
Through God's wise providence, such radiant hours do not linger,because our strength is not fed with them.We shall not get much working strength out of whipped cream,however pleasant it tastes;and if we rely on the raptures of Paradise for our sources of spiritual power,we shall come lamentable short of our true reinforcements.So God,in His mercy,gives them once or twice,now and again,and,at the time of sending them,accompanies them with a thorn that we may be reminded of our utter weakness and helplessness and be driven to avail ourselves of His grace,in which alone is our sufficiency.
Do not expect the vision of Paradise to linger;it would dazzle you and make life unnatural and unreal.Do not regret the passage of the blessed ,rapturous hours,light of step and fleet of pace.Do not think that you have fallen from grace when their flush and glow are over.Whether they come to you constantly or not,or even if they never visit you,you are still in Christ,still joined to the Lord,still accepted in the Beloved;and neither height of rapture,nor depth of depression shall ever separate you from the love of God that is in Jesus Christ our Lord.Be content,then,to turn,as Jesus did,from the rapture of Paradise,presented on the Transfiguration Mount,to take the way of the cross through which you will become able to open Paradise to souls in despair ,like the dying thief.
The Discipline of Pain
Paul's "thorn" must have been VERY painful.In infinite wisdom,God permitted the messenger of Satan to buffet his servant,and all through that first missionary journey,Paul had to face a long succession of buffetings.There were perils of robbers,of waters,of mountain passes,and of violent crowds;but in addition to all,there was the lacerating thorn.
Paul could have suffered from weak eyes or some distressing form of opthamalia.We infer this from the eagerness of his Galatian converts to give him their eyes,from his dependence on an amanuensis,and from the clumsy letters with which he wrote the postscripts to his epistles(Gal 6:11)..And if this were the case,the pain would be greatly aggravated as he faced the keen blasts that swept the mountain plateau on which the Pisidian Antioch was situated.
Was it during this journey that Paul sought the Lord on three separate occasions for deliverance and received the assurance that though the thorn were left,more than sufficient grace would be given(2 Corinthians 12:9)?If so,like a peal of bells,at Antioch,Iconium,Derbe, and Lystra,he must have heard the music of those tender words:My grace is sufficient,sufficient,SUFFICIENT for you!Sufficient when friends forsake and foes pursue;sufficient to make you strong against a raging synagogue or a shower of stones;sufficient for excessive labors of body and conflicts of soul,sufficient to enable you to do as much work,and even more,than if the body were perfectly whole--for my strength is made perfect only amid the conditions of mortal weakness.
In estimating the greatness of a man's lifework,it is fair to take into consideration the difficulties under which the man has accomplished it.And how greatly does our appreciation of the apostle rise when we remember that he was incessantly in pain.Instead,however,of sitting down in despair and pleading physical infirmity as his excuse for doing nothing,he bravely claimed the grace that waited within and did greater work through God's enabling power than he could have done through his own had it been unhindered by his weakness.
Ah,afflicted ones,your disabilities were meant to unite with God's enablings,your weakness to mate his Power.Do not sit before that mistaken marriage,that uncongenial business,that unfortunate partnership,that physical weakness,that hesitancy of speech,that disfigurement of face,as though it must necessarily maim and conquer you.God's grace is at hand--sufficient--and at its best when human weakness is most profound.Appropriate it and learn that those who wait on God are stronger in their weakness than sons of men in their stoutest health and vigor.
*Romans 8:35 Who will separate us from the love of the Christ? Will tribulation or distress or persecution or hunger or nakedness or danger or sword? 36 Just as it is written: “For your sake we are being put to death all day long, we have been accounted as sheep for slaughtering.” 37 To the contrary, in all these things we are coming off completely victorious through him that loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life nor angels nor governments nor things now here nor things to come nor powers 39 nor height nor depth nor any other creation will be able to separate us from God’s love that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
*Hebrews 12:11 True, no discipline seems for the present to be joyous, but grievous; yet afterward to those who have been trained by it it yields peaceable fruit, namely, righteousness. 12 Hence straighten up the hands that hang down and the enfeebled knees, 13 and keep making straight paths for your feet, that what is lame may not be put out of joint, but rather that it may be healed.
*2 Corinthians 12:6 For if I ever do want to boast, I shall not be unreasonable, for I shall say the truth. But I abstain, in order that no one should put to my credit more than what he sees I am or he hears from me, 7 just because of the excess of the revelations. Therefore, that I might not feel overly exalted, there was given me a thorn in the flesh, an angel of Satan, to keep slapping me, that I might not be overly exalted. 8 In this behalf I three times entreated the Lord that it might depart from me; 9 and yet he really said to me: “My undeserved kindness is sufficient for you; for [my] power is being made perfect in weakness.” Most gladly, therefore, will I rather boast as respects my weaknesses, that the power of the Christ may like a tent remain over me. 10 Therefore I take pleasure in weaknesses, in insults, in cases of need, in persecutions and difficulties, for Christ. For when I am weak, then I am powerful.
Thursday, October 22, 2009
Support our troops?
I found this blog that was written on January 4,2007 by Steve Scianni.I just wanted to share it.I agree on so many levels.
http://hungertruth.blogspot.com/
We see it on bumper stickers and we hear it constantly, 'Support the troops.' Now let me ask a question: what does this mean exactly? I wish someone who says this would actually finish the thought and tell me what it means and just how we are to do this. Does it mean we support every word they say and every action they take, whether good or bad? Does it mean that we leave them overseas and send reinforcements? Does it mean that we cannot criticize the President, his Administration and the War? Well whatever it may mean, it ought to never inspire the American people to swallow every word the President speaks, nor should it stop us from criticizing a war that has proven to be criminal, illegal and murderous.
It should never stop the American people from telling the President that we will not be lied to anymore...that we do not want our taxes to buy one more bomb, fly one more plane, ship one more troop, or kill one more Iraqi.
By supporting our troops I mean that the American people need to stand up and fight this corrupt administration and let them know that we do not condone the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqi's...that we do not like seeing our soldiers maimed and killed....that we are not interested in ruining lives and families...that we abhor the lies and propaganda of a false 'war on terror'...that we are not Imperialists and have no business invading a foreign country.
By 'supporting the troops' I mean very simply that the American people reject the war. I also mean that we tell the President and his cabinet we know what they are doing and that the gig is up....that we know about the scandalous corporate profiteering in Iraq...that we understand the horrors of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and the negligence with which our returning troops are treated. We will tell them that we know Saddam Hussein was a puppet empowered and used by the United States and that by killing him was only destroying what we initially created...we know that Iraq has no connection to 9/11 and they have no WMDs...we also know that what they do have is what the U.S. has always wanted -- large oil reserves...we know about the secret wars and coups of the CIA and U.S. Government in the past (in Venezuela, Cuba, Iran, etc. etc.)...we know that our Imperialistic, Bully-minded foreign policy does not 'fight' or 'eliminate' any threat, it only creates terrorists and hatred for America...we know, we know, we know!
And this is the saddest part, that a country built on such great principles and ideals, the "land of the free," is being ruined and villainized around the globe by militaristic officials and greedy corporate scoundrels. Think about it!? Why does the U.S. encounter such hostility around the planet? Very simple, because we are oppressive and brutal to the rest of the world. And then we wonder why they burn our flag and blow up our buildings?
What a sad testimony to the intellect of Americans when they get fooled by a line like, "They hate us for our freedom." This is perhaps the most absurd thing any U.S. President has ever said. In answer to the question, why are there terrorists and why do they hate us, this is the most childish and devious response anyone can voice, and here is the tragedy, (1) it came from the 'leader' of our country and (2) the American people believe it! Listen, NOBODY hates anybody for having freedom...people hate because they are DENIED their freedoms and that is what the U.S. has done time after time, and they continue to do so now. We deny them their liberties, we deny them their land, their resources, their governments, their livelihoods, their houses and their lives -- THAT Mr. President is why they hate us and everyone seems to know it but the Americans.......shame.
Support the troops by bringing them home and ending the war....support the troops by impeaching the President....support the troops by demanding that our military ONLY be used to defend our borders...support our troops by educating them into Intelligent Individuals, not Robotic Slaves who kill on command...support the troops by supporting this Lieutenant who refuses to go to Iraq http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/scp_v3/viewer/index.php?pid=16598&rn
=49750&cl=1585703&ch=87581&src=www.yahoo.com(this link is not working now)
Steve Scianni
Here's a video I thought I'd share as well.
Yes,war is traumatic.No,the UN can not end it.I saw a picture where a girl was holding a sign "Bombing for peace is like having sex for virginity."(only she used a bad word)
Only Yehovah can end killing and war and injustice and trauma etc..God will destroy everything nefarious and evil.He will not preserve it in flames forever,but instead make sure it doesn't exist anymore.He said there would be no more sin,excluding the possibility that sinners will be alive.And without sin He won't have wrath.Wrath is not what magnifies his holiness,except to eliminate all things that kindle it.."Making all things new" will magnify his holiness.
I can't imagine supporting and participating in a war where we murder our SUPPOSED enemies(even though propaganda is sometimes what makes us believe they are) when Jesus said to pray for our enemies and those persecuting us and that those who kill by the sword will die by the sword.We're supposed to follow Jesus's footsteps closely and I did not see him killing those threatening him.If the governments are controlled by Satan(revelation says the dragon gave the beast its power) then why support the beast led by the dragon?Isn't that ultimately supporting the dragon(Satan)?I'm not sure how anyone cannot see that Revelation and prophetic scriptures are being fulfilled before our very eyes.But then again,since Satan permeates the air and the world. I guess I shouldn't be surprised at the prominence of mass deception everywhere,from false teachings within Christianity to the increasing denial of God's existence to governmental injustices and ceaseless war.
haha..clean it up!!
http://hungertruth.blogspot.com/
We see it on bumper stickers and we hear it constantly, 'Support the troops.' Now let me ask a question: what does this mean exactly? I wish someone who says this would actually finish the thought and tell me what it means and just how we are to do this. Does it mean we support every word they say and every action they take, whether good or bad? Does it mean that we leave them overseas and send reinforcements? Does it mean that we cannot criticize the President, his Administration and the War? Well whatever it may mean, it ought to never inspire the American people to swallow every word the President speaks, nor should it stop us from criticizing a war that has proven to be criminal, illegal and murderous.
It should never stop the American people from telling the President that we will not be lied to anymore...that we do not want our taxes to buy one more bomb, fly one more plane, ship one more troop, or kill one more Iraqi.
By supporting our troops I mean that the American people need to stand up and fight this corrupt administration and let them know that we do not condone the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqi's...that we do not like seeing our soldiers maimed and killed....that we are not interested in ruining lives and families...that we abhor the lies and propaganda of a false 'war on terror'...that we are not Imperialists and have no business invading a foreign country.
By 'supporting the troops' I mean very simply that the American people reject the war. I also mean that we tell the President and his cabinet we know what they are doing and that the gig is up....that we know about the scandalous corporate profiteering in Iraq...that we understand the horrors of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and the negligence with which our returning troops are treated. We will tell them that we know Saddam Hussein was a puppet empowered and used by the United States and that by killing him was only destroying what we initially created...we know that Iraq has no connection to 9/11 and they have no WMDs...we also know that what they do have is what the U.S. has always wanted -- large oil reserves...we know about the secret wars and coups of the CIA and U.S. Government in the past (in Venezuela, Cuba, Iran, etc. etc.)...we know that our Imperialistic, Bully-minded foreign policy does not 'fight' or 'eliminate' any threat, it only creates terrorists and hatred for America...we know, we know, we know!
And this is the saddest part, that a country built on such great principles and ideals, the "land of the free," is being ruined and villainized around the globe by militaristic officials and greedy corporate scoundrels. Think about it!? Why does the U.S. encounter such hostility around the planet? Very simple, because we are oppressive and brutal to the rest of the world. And then we wonder why they burn our flag and blow up our buildings?
What a sad testimony to the intellect of Americans when they get fooled by a line like, "They hate us for our freedom." This is perhaps the most absurd thing any U.S. President has ever said. In answer to the question, why are there terrorists and why do they hate us, this is the most childish and devious response anyone can voice, and here is the tragedy, (1) it came from the 'leader' of our country and (2) the American people believe it! Listen, NOBODY hates anybody for having freedom...people hate because they are DENIED their freedoms and that is what the U.S. has done time after time, and they continue to do so now. We deny them their liberties, we deny them their land, their resources, their governments, their livelihoods, their houses and their lives -- THAT Mr. President is why they hate us and everyone seems to know it but the Americans.......shame.
Support the troops by bringing them home and ending the war....support the troops by impeaching the President....support the troops by demanding that our military ONLY be used to defend our borders...support our troops by educating them into Intelligent Individuals, not Robotic Slaves who kill on command...support the troops by supporting this Lieutenant who refuses to go to Iraq http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/scp_v3/viewer/index.php?pid=16598&rn
=49750&cl=1585703&ch=87581&src=www.yahoo.com(this link is not working now)
Steve Scianni
Here's a video I thought I'd share as well.
Yes,war is traumatic.No,the UN can not end it.I saw a picture where a girl was holding a sign "Bombing for peace is like having sex for virginity."(only she used a bad word)
Only Yehovah can end killing and war and injustice and trauma etc..God will destroy everything nefarious and evil.He will not preserve it in flames forever,but instead make sure it doesn't exist anymore.He said there would be no more sin,excluding the possibility that sinners will be alive.And without sin He won't have wrath.Wrath is not what magnifies his holiness,except to eliminate all things that kindle it.."Making all things new" will magnify his holiness.
I can't imagine supporting and participating in a war where we murder our SUPPOSED enemies(even though propaganda is sometimes what makes us believe they are) when Jesus said to pray for our enemies and those persecuting us and that those who kill by the sword will die by the sword.We're supposed to follow Jesus's footsteps closely and I did not see him killing those threatening him.If the governments are controlled by Satan(revelation says the dragon gave the beast its power) then why support the beast led by the dragon?Isn't that ultimately supporting the dragon(Satan)?I'm not sure how anyone cannot see that Revelation and prophetic scriptures are being fulfilled before our very eyes.But then again,since Satan permeates the air and the world. I guess I shouldn't be surprised at the prominence of mass deception everywhere,from false teachings within Christianity to the increasing denial of God's existence to governmental injustices and ceaseless war.
haha..clean it up!!
Friday, October 2, 2009
Romans 9..Calvinist's mother's milk.
This man believes in the trinity and orthodox hellfire misintepretation but I still respect this competent exegesis of Romans 9.There are other possibilities I have heard before that are sensible as well..anything that lines up with the entirety of the scriptures and God's definition of and revelation of his own personality is obviously superior to the Calvinist one.I recommend cutting and pasting the url and watching it on youtube as it will be bigger there.It's one of those big vids that consumes your screen ;)..One thumb up for exposing and refuting Calvinism.One thumb down for not being able to exegete hellfire passages the same way you do Romans 9.(in their OT context,for heaven's sake)(to the guy in this vid)
addendum:Btw,I have 2 new Romans 9 exegesis blogs from January 2010.Read parts 1 and 2 for my take on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msu-dtnge5M
As I watched this,I was reminded how small and narrow minded the Calvinist interpretation of Romans 9 actually is.It is very similar to hellfire adherents inability to interpret texts in their OT context that CLEARLY explains what it all means.Obviously,this will not be good enough for most Calvinists assuming they "make sure of all things" before adopting their erroneoous theology.For those Calvinists who say that the texts should just be read straight through and believed by what they say on the surface and the entire bible interpreted in light of that, I can only wonder why in the world you think one chapter in the bible that is explained in context like this guy competently does here should make the entire bible's constant revelations of God's impartiality and awe inspiring awesome personality moot.Of COURSE he has wrath but it is only temporary and against willful unrepentant sinners detrimentally abusing their free will,always.As a Calvinist,you are no longer able to interpret the bible straightforwardly like you brag about doing in Romans 9!Every text you behold becomes "well,in light of Romans 9" instead of just simple truth.I will provide a few very sarcastic examples for those who can stomach sarcasm now and then to get a point across.If not,skip ahead and save yourself the trouble of taking offense ;)
Deut 30:19:I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live..Oh wait!I have already chosen for you so just go about your business and assume you're saved..if you aren't,sorry 'bout that!My fault!All these declarations I make that you have a choice are a SHOW,a facade.Not sure why I keep telling you to repent and that you have the choice but no..I will repent FOR you and make the choice on your behalf.Sit back and let me do all the work while you just skip about hoping you're like Jacob and not Esau!
Proverbs 1:29 For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD because I didn't let them because I am sadistically partial EVEN though I SAID I epitomize love and am impartial .I just want to see some folks burn(forever!) because it magnifies my holiness according to some men who didn't really get this notion from the book I wrote for them.But ,then,don't say I didn't warn you about false teachers now!My holiness is in fact magnified by ELIMINATING evil and "making all things new",not by preserving the worst kind imaginable into all of eternity.But don't let me telling you the wicked will be consumed and become ashes make you think they won't be alive forever in flames!Instead,let traditon,symbolism and manmade philosophy become your reality over my clear testimony!
Jeremiah 32:35:they built the high places of Baal that are in the valley of Ben-hinnom to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I had not commanded them nor had it entered My mind that they should do this abomination..Erase that!Not only did it enter my mind,but I decreed it and am so pleased to see my holiness magnified in this absurd display of sadism and horror.It makes the good I will decree shine that much brighter!Praise my haphazard sadism and be glad that I was partial enough to choose you for NO reason whatsoever and burn innocent children for my good pleasure even though it disgusts me..Makes sense,huh?Did I mention I am haphazard and partial?
James 4:8 Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.Hold up!Let me rearrange."God will MAKE you draw close to him and purify your hearts.You cannot do it of your own initiative"
Eve SAID she was deceived by the serpent when in all actuality,she was deceived by me and then sinned because I made her.Poor Eve.She's just a pawn in my game and though all evidence points to the fact that she had the choice to partake of the fruit or not,ignore that evidence!Obviously,she didn't.And then she didn't become ashes at all..she's still burning where worms never die..worms said to be on corpses in Is 66:24 but don't believe that!They're on souls burning alive!
Texts like these(minus the sarcasm of the Calvinist God's rearrangement) are endless and should not be interpreted in light of men's flawed exegesis of a few texts that have superior interpretations like the ones presented in the vid above.Calvinism truly concerns me because the God of Calvinism is NOT the God of true Christianity.
Acts 10:34 For a certainty I perceive that God is not partial, 35 but in every nation the man that fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him. (It doesn't say God is partial and in every nation the man that he makes fear him will be acceptable..does it?)The Calvinist rearrangement of texts rivals the trinitarian!I'm not sure who would win in the "make it fit" competition!
God DESIRES all men to attain to repentance.That is honestly what he desires.As a Calvinist,your arrogant perception is an atrocious attack on God's true desires.Let Him be as merciful, loving, impartial, and just as he wants to be.Stop misrepresenting him and extending the wrath he has against sin into all of eternity where the kingdom is supposed to reign with NO sin or death,as opposed to sinners being preserved in an "eternal dying process".A kingdom where whoever CHOSE life and used their free will according to God's purposes will live forever in benevolent conditions without arrogantly perceiving they got there because God played duck duck goose and decided to burn others who weren't as fortunate in the game for all of eternity.If that makes you feel good,see a therapist.If you can live peacefully and blissfully in your arrogance with people you loved burning alive forever,see a therapist.
Btw,this is a plea to accept truth and an attack on giant misrepresentations of God and not on Calvinist individuals who have been misled.
addendum:Btw,I have 2 new Romans 9 exegesis blogs from January 2010.Read parts 1 and 2 for my take on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msu-dtnge5M
As I watched this,I was reminded how small and narrow minded the Calvinist interpretation of Romans 9 actually is.It is very similar to hellfire adherents inability to interpret texts in their OT context that CLEARLY explains what it all means.Obviously,this will not be good enough for most Calvinists assuming they "make sure of all things" before adopting their erroneoous theology.For those Calvinists who say that the texts should just be read straight through and believed by what they say on the surface and the entire bible interpreted in light of that, I can only wonder why in the world you think one chapter in the bible that is explained in context like this guy competently does here should make the entire bible's constant revelations of God's impartiality and awe inspiring awesome personality moot.Of COURSE he has wrath but it is only temporary and against willful unrepentant sinners detrimentally abusing their free will,always.As a Calvinist,you are no longer able to interpret the bible straightforwardly like you brag about doing in Romans 9!Every text you behold becomes "well,in light of Romans 9" instead of just simple truth.I will provide a few very sarcastic examples for those who can stomach sarcasm now and then to get a point across.If not,skip ahead and save yourself the trouble of taking offense ;)
Deut 30:19:I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live..Oh wait!I have already chosen for you so just go about your business and assume you're saved..if you aren't,sorry 'bout that!My fault!All these declarations I make that you have a choice are a SHOW,a facade.Not sure why I keep telling you to repent and that you have the choice but no..I will repent FOR you and make the choice on your behalf.Sit back and let me do all the work while you just skip about hoping you're like Jacob and not Esau!
Proverbs 1:29 For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD because I didn't let them because I am sadistically partial EVEN though I SAID I epitomize love and am impartial .I just want to see some folks burn(forever!) because it magnifies my holiness according to some men who didn't really get this notion from the book I wrote for them.But ,then,don't say I didn't warn you about false teachers now!My holiness is in fact magnified by ELIMINATING evil and "making all things new",not by preserving the worst kind imaginable into all of eternity.But don't let me telling you the wicked will be consumed and become ashes make you think they won't be alive forever in flames!Instead,let traditon,symbolism and manmade philosophy become your reality over my clear testimony!
Jeremiah 32:35:they built the high places of Baal that are in the valley of Ben-hinnom to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I had not commanded them nor had it entered My mind that they should do this abomination..Erase that!Not only did it enter my mind,but I decreed it and am so pleased to see my holiness magnified in this absurd display of sadism and horror.It makes the good I will decree shine that much brighter!Praise my haphazard sadism and be glad that I was partial enough to choose you for NO reason whatsoever and burn innocent children for my good pleasure even though it disgusts me..Makes sense,huh?Did I mention I am haphazard and partial?
James 4:8 Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.Hold up!Let me rearrange."God will MAKE you draw close to him and purify your hearts.You cannot do it of your own initiative"
Eve SAID she was deceived by the serpent when in all actuality,she was deceived by me and then sinned because I made her.Poor Eve.She's just a pawn in my game and though all evidence points to the fact that she had the choice to partake of the fruit or not,ignore that evidence!Obviously,she didn't.And then she didn't become ashes at all..she's still burning where worms never die..worms said to be on corpses in Is 66:24 but don't believe that!They're on souls burning alive!
Texts like these(minus the sarcasm of the Calvinist God's rearrangement) are endless and should not be interpreted in light of men's flawed exegesis of a few texts that have superior interpretations like the ones presented in the vid above.Calvinism truly concerns me because the God of Calvinism is NOT the God of true Christianity.
Acts 10:34 For a certainty I perceive that God is not partial, 35 but in every nation the man that fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him. (It doesn't say God is partial and in every nation the man that he makes fear him will be acceptable..does it?)The Calvinist rearrangement of texts rivals the trinitarian!I'm not sure who would win in the "make it fit" competition!
God DESIRES all men to attain to repentance.That is honestly what he desires.As a Calvinist,your arrogant perception is an atrocious attack on God's true desires.Let Him be as merciful, loving, impartial, and just as he wants to be.Stop misrepresenting him and extending the wrath he has against sin into all of eternity where the kingdom is supposed to reign with NO sin or death,as opposed to sinners being preserved in an "eternal dying process".A kingdom where whoever CHOSE life and used their free will according to God's purposes will live forever in benevolent conditions without arrogantly perceiving they got there because God played duck duck goose and decided to burn others who weren't as fortunate in the game for all of eternity.If that makes you feel good,see a therapist.If you can live peacefully and blissfully in your arrogance with people you loved burning alive forever,see a therapist.
Btw,this is a plea to accept truth and an attack on giant misrepresentations of God and not on Calvinist individuals who have been misled.
Saturday, September 19, 2009
21crosscheck21 posts a sensationalized video PLUS a bonus hell rant
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHBNXrBYqow
I urge everyone to go to youtube to watch this video and read ABibleReader's comments about what the mother said about this tragedy..She thinks it was murder. Also,ABibleReader made some logical truthful comments about how Christians traumatize kids with hellfire preachin' consistently.(I personally was traumatized by my great grandpa's passionate preaching about it when I was little)As well as facts about how prominent suicide is for boys this age.So to isolate a JW case and blame it on the WT when NOTHING is known is just bizarre.This is a tragedy to be sure ..That is why I hate to see it being exploited when no one knows the facts!!
WHY else do I think it was wrong for Brian to post this?Because news programs are about sensationalism.No one knows what happened!So to sensationalize something like this and to think that preaching Armageddon is an abomination when you personally preach something as heinous atrocious monstrous and disgusting as eternal hellfire is hypocritical and preposterous.I like Brian and that is why it upsets me all the more to see intelligent nice people like him exploiting something like this when they have a massive erroneous doctrine like hellfire they use like a weapon against anyone they wish up their theological sleeve.I know one argument traditionalists will use is that their children are assured of a heavenly calling.Well I for one would find no comfort in that whatsoever if my little friends at school who weren't as "Christian" as I would never be fanned in the flames of hell.Talk about traumatic!And what about family who perhaps think Jesus is God's son as opposed to God or don't believe at all?I have to live with their screams of terror for an infinity in a supposedly blissful kingdom?PLEASE!If I believed in hell,I would live and breathe traumatized!And it is truly a perturbing thing to be child trying with all your little heart and soul to understand how love and mercy can be reconciled with hellfire and how God's son is God!I knew God could not be balanced or truthful at all if these lies were true!John 3:16 alone disproves both.Believe it or not,I am not advocating the excessive WT depictions of Armageddon etc. but trust me..logically,heartfeltly,it is the lesser of two evils.To say the least!Children have VIVID imaginations and sensitive hearts and it doesn't take pictures for them to "see" what you tell them to believe!Poor kids.How very big of you Brian to lambast people who preach destruction when you preach the boldfaced lie of eternal life in flames for the majority of mankind!The same ol Satanic lie..no one ever REALLY dies.Back to the Garden of Eden for some education.
Genesis 3:19:For dust you are and to dust you will return.
Sounds kinda like :
Matthew 3:12 His winnowing shovel is in his hand, and he will completely clean up his threshing floor, and will gather his wheat into the storehouse, but the chaff he will BURN UP with fire that cannot be put out.(what happens in fire Brian?Did anyone stay alive in gehenna?)
I'm thinkin' in John 3:16 ,when it says the wicked shall perish,that it pretty much means what it says!
To anyone who lives to criticize the WT for their faults(and yes they have them I know!)Time to examine yourself first.
Matthew 7:3 Why, then, do you look at the straw in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the rafter in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Allow me to extract the straw from your eye’; when, look! a rafter is in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First extract the rafter from your own eye, and then you will see clearly how to extract the straw from your brother’s eye.
If the WT is a cult what would you call the broad and spacious road that preaches "Christianity's" two biggest most detrimental lies..the trinity and hell?You'd probably call it "truth" if you're fond of tradition and philosophy of men.But I would venture to say you're fooling yourself.God said "This is my son"..what about THAT is hard to understand?God also said "The wicked shall perish"..That is precise language as well..
I sincerely hope Brian takes no offense but instead continues to prayerfully investigate his core beliefs as I think he is a smart man who Jah could use to grand effect with the right humble spirit,willingness to reform..AGAIN,and to accept blatant truth when it is shown him straight from the pages of scripture.I am not talking about symbolic texts being taken literally and elaborate inferences about God's son being anything but his father's servant and agent and son in some philosophical 4th century manmade formula either.God how I pray truth will reign and become clearer to the sincere hearted as time draws closer for the establishment of His perfect kingdom restored to this earth.
Here's the reality,Brian.You are judging people who preach annihilation when you preach hellfire!The hypocrisy and absurdity there is striking!Yes the pictures might disturb children..(please note JW children are taught positive things from scripture more than armageddon)..But to confidently articulate(yes I've heard you speak about your beliefs) a fiery fairy tale of the worst kind of sadistic evil man or child could EVER imagine?UNFORGIVABLE.Here's hoping you and every other stubborn Christian will delve deeply into logic and exegesis and pick apart every text they think proves hellfire and "make sure of all things",holding fast to what is good and true!
You can start by googling "everlasting torment examined" by Steve Scianni.And that's just the beginning of exegesis available that actually remains within the bounds of logic,recognizing the symbolism and hyperbole in Revelation,understanding what gehenna entails,refusing to look at words like "destroyed,perish,ashes" as anything but what they would reasonably say.etc.Why?Because you're preaching the same lie Satan did and traumatizing children and adults alike.Those who don't just look for any way out that they can..like atheism..to avoid believing in a sadist God.You don't know his personality and that confounds me!The bible is clear.The worst that ever happened to sinners?Agony leading to death.That satisfies God's wrath against sin.To get rid of it.His holiness is magnified in "making all things new" without the preservation of the most heinous evil man could ever imagine into all of eternity.That would hamper the kingdom peace,no?
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